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Well, I've dipped my toe in and ordered a few models in HP Black. I'm hoping it's a lot smoother than the original SF range and the detail is there. We'll see how it goes.

I'm happy enough with the material that I'll turn it on for most of my medium-scale models as soon as Shapeways makes it available to general customers. And I think the materials will be popular.

That said, we saw in 2014 and in 2017 how painful it can be when Shapeways has to adjust their pricing, so I'm hoping the initial public pricing can be set to be a very good match to the cost of producing models in this material. That will ensure we don't design models with one set of design criteria in mind, only to have them change shortly afterwards. (e.g. "oops, should I add sprues to everything?").

Well, I just filled out an official Shapeways survey on this material which was sent to me by email.

Overall, I am satisfied for what the black material is right now at this price level. It is good, but not an actual improvement. The gray version looks HORRIBLE in my opinion. I'm amazed at how many people actually tried this.

I'd say they will have to make these HP printers print this material in all sorts of colors, pastel and neon and translucent colors as well. If not - and it's just going to be this Black and Gray.....then I see this as nothing more than a stop gap solution to faster production and lowered prices.

If you're going to paint it (like my models), it doesn't really matter what colour it is, ultimately, though grey is a good neutral colour; white and black are not ideal base colours. For high detail, black doesn't tend to photograph as well - granted, though, I haven't tried the HP Black - and WSF is particularly difficult for my models to take pictures of (see example above!) since it reflects too much. (You could make an argument for the black if you do undercoat; but then again you want to make sure you cover the model fully to avoid the pain seeping in too much.)

(The surface finish is also slightly smoother, and while I personally had no problems with WSF, some wargamers get a paranoid about it, so if the price holds, for my market at least, it'll be a replacement for Transparent Detail and cheaper alternative to the FUD.)



I'll be likely filling out my survey slightly later, since to be able to answer the questions properly, we need to do a bit more field-testing (at least have my Dad use the new models at the next convention at the weekend.)

Really now ?

Just see my post on page 7.

My models are accessories for Transformers, which more often than not feature plenty of friction points/surfaces - so painting them is not a good option. Style wise, the originals were all-black too; so....the way detail photographs on my HP black prints is almost on par with Hasbro's black ABS.

Still, as content as I am with finally having a "Black Strong Flexible Polished" in the HP Black material - it isn't a leap forward YET, in terms of material qualities and attributes for consumer-end purposes.
For this to become really versatile; they need to work out the kinks, then come up with pastels, neons and translucency.

I had not (or it was sufficiently long ago I had forgotten).

As a stand-alone, then, I can grant you it looks better than the grey, which is a bit mottled.

I haven't tried painting HPSF without undercoating, but I would be surprised if it doesn't have some of the issues of WSF if you don't undercoat first (same as with any material, there, though, be it metal, plastic or resin, you pretty much always want to undercoat first - I do that as a matter of course), though, so even so, then, the black probably doesn't have any advantages over the grey for my specific purposes.


I would have to say I doubt the latter is viable, given that the material is essentially still a powder-with-dye/stiffener as I understand it. One would assume other colours may be a possibility at some point.

When is the price going to drop??

Are we getting any closer to seeing this material made generally available? Things have been awfully quiet on this and related threads.

Now that I have had chance to do some painting:



What we have here are two GSF on the left and centre, and WSF on the right. Once painted, not a lot of difference to the naked eye (I had to peer into the flightstand hole in the base tow rok out which was which!), albiet the Scitalis doesn't have as much sharp detail like the T-80 I posted previously.

(These are 144th scale "bikes," something over an inch or so long. Yes, I appreciate that makes them larger than a typical saloon car at that scale, but that's what happened when you make it big enough to fly, have a canopy so it can have shields and be big enough to fit a chap in full powered armour inside!)

But this determined that, basically, yes, the HPSF paints up pretty much identically to WSF.

Hi Shapeways, @AlanHudson @Andrewsimonthomas @LinnemanAngela @RudyLime (Shapeways folks that have responded in this thread)

If you're still considering when to make the HP materials more generally available, I would suggest that "in time for holiday sales" would be an excellent answer! For my part, I will make this the default material (rather than WSF) for many of my designs in 1:144 scale and larger (keeping FUD or FXD for the smaller scales).

Now, I know, there may be other considerations at hand, but it will be much better for sales if it's done in November than if it's done in January.

+1 for any news on general availability.
I need to adapt some designs for the size variation, so it would be good for planning purposes to know roughly when HP black & grey will be offered.

Has there been a pricing change on this overnight? I was checking a few of my models to order test prints and it looks like the HP materials have just about doubled in price for everything.

This does appear to be the case. It looks like they are now pricing HP plastic like premium black or white SF plastics.

HP plastic:
$5.00/part
$0.56/material cm3
$0.42/machine cm3

Previously HP plastic was priced as color polished plastics:

$2.50/part
$0.28/material cm3
$0.21/machine cm3

I'm very glad to see the availability expanding, but I'm very disappointed with the price change. For the quality provided and price point this was rapidly becoming my favorite material. Now the price is putting it out of reach for many models that I would have gladly used it for in favor of WSF.

Yes. It had a good chunk of potential, which has been completely wasted by the pricing. (My Dad (who is if anything, more tight-fisted than me) was even considering having it as th default for when I do him models. I already know what his reaction to the price increase will be.)

I will not be using the material again, nor will I be green-lighting it for my webstore. Given that now it cannot even compete with FUD; it's not worth my time to do so.

Wow .. just astounding, in a really bad way.

My HP beta prints came out fine as the equivalent of what would have been Black Strong Flexible Polished - and now Shapeways suddenly jacks up the price just after that pricy Premium WSF.

Resin casters and 3rd party ABS producers have nothing to fear the way this is going obviously.
HP & Premium WSF products will not be competitive at this price point at all for a loooooong time.....

For my products, standard S&F is right on the price limit. It's barley profitable to sell most parts. Jack the price up a little, and nobody buys it. There's ZERO chance of me selling any HP S&F at that price!

What a disappointment. I will not be ordering this material again. It is a slight improvement on WSF, but not enough to pay twice the price.

Oh, that buggeres that up. Was just thinking we would be on to a winner here. Guess I won't be able to release models in the material then with the price. Is up there with the FUDs.

Sigh.

Good news: HP is finally showing color prints with 500/300 series. PDF mentions models 580 & 380 for 8 agent and full color, 540 & 340 for 4 agent and just B&W, 5x0 has bigger bucket in one dimension.
http://www8.hp.com/us/en/printers/3d-printers/3dcolorprint.html
http://www8.hp.com/h20195/v2/getpdf.aspx/4AA7-1970ENA.pdf

Bad news: It's not SW's current model 4200 (along entry 3200 and "manufacturing targeted" 4210), neither externally looks similar. No color info provided, beyond what looks to be CMYKW (and wild guess of 317 DPI imposed by 0.08 mm layers, and 1200 DPI in XY if matching the grey printers). Examples look a bit pastel.

Questions: Will HP replace full machines or provide conversions kits to testing companies? Will SW buy some of this new type (or even 4210 to pump more for less)? How much will color / B&W prints cost?