New price structure

I understand that Shapeways want to streamline their operation, but if a user is to put the effort in to design products to make them more efficient to produce they should not be penalised by paying a higher price.

Because many of my models are small the new price means it'll be more work to produce my models to be printed more efficiently but instead of me seeing a benefit I am charged more and Shapeways are increasing their profits.

Why does it cost $9.50 to send a package weighing only a few grams? And why is shipping almost 1/3rd cheaper to the U.S. when I live 1/10th of the distance away?

I order nothing like the number of models from Shapeways I used to; I have hardly added anything public to my shop in recent months and this is because I am disappointed in the way Shapeways are going. I used to love Shapeways but now with the long lead times, increase in prices for my models and cancellation of customers orders because a model is "too thin to print" despite being printed 30-40 times before I am now lacking the enthusiasm to produce more models.

Sad regards,

Jack

designerica (respectfully) did you view the last SW Live yet?
My summary is that the pricing structure re-vamp is needed for SW to carry on providing their 3D printing services. Yes, it has made me re-evaluate my stance, adapt to survive and all that.

oh and yes, UPS sucks. USPS would be better. i've mentioned before that i'd even rather spend my own time and pick up from the new york office than deal with UPS in some cases. sometimes they deliver in 1 day, but other times they are just unbearable.

as for detecting multiple parts in a file (now that i read the rest of the comments on the forums since the blog comments seem to be shut down), if you start in with that i'll definitely be moving to prometal for my manufacturing because you forced me to design small, thin objects to be able to sell them affordably and now i like my designs and want to continue to produce them as they are, and if you make it impossible for me to produce them affordably i will certainly go elsewhere for my printing services. i already pay ponoko club membership for my laser cutting.

no, ana, i hadn't. i've been working like crazy to repackage and mail out the shipments from shapeways that arrived late to me. i spent yesterday afternoon trying reach someone at shapeways about the order that was promised and failed to arrive. then last night was the jewish new year. plus i'm sick. i have not had a chance to watch it all but i just watched some of it.

i understand what you are saying, but it doesn't change the fact that in order to maintain my prices on the small items i have already been producing i would have to continue to bundle them or go elsewhere. i have the facilities to do my own sprew removal on the steel, and i'm getting no benefit from your retail portal.

the last time a co-creator model was ordered from me, i uploaded a file immediately and even though i could see it in your system, it was considered lost and a month later i was asked to upload it again after the customer contacted me and i contacted shapeways. so the co-creator platform doesn't work right, either.

so please, tell us all, what would we be getting from shapeways that i couldn't get elsewhere?

i really really really think you're biting off more than you can chew trying to figure out manufacturing AND retailing at once.

me != ana, she's much more pretty and i've got a beard...

sounds like you've been having a rough time... chin up

I'm guessing Shapeways always uses UPS as the have an exclusive deal with them which gives them access some very keen pricing. So 90% of the customers benefit buy getting cheap posting but a few suffer through UPS excessive service charges and maybe poor service in some areas. I've always found the subcontractor who does my UPS deliveries here fine so I'm in the happy 90%.

Just to give you an illustration of how good a deal Shapeways is getting I looked at sending a small package but the same service Shapeways uses. I was quoted 26 Euros . So if I want to use that service I have to pay 30% more that the 25$ Shapeways minimum order - and Shapeways has to do all the handling and of course actually produce the item for that !

Someone at Shapeways was a mean negotiator when they got their deal !

oh ha ha sorry.

i'm really having a tough week. yes. ups screwed up, shapeways screwed up, prometal screwed up, i screwed up, i got sick.

I feel for you Erica, the new pricing scheme has me tearing my hair out too (not that I had much left anyway.) lol.

I understand Shapeways is a business, and needs to keep afloat, but if they alienate customers who design and buy small items, that won't be helping their bottom line either, they will just go someplace else.

when i cast something, a larger, more complex item requires more sprues. more sprues= more finishing work.

is that NOT true in this case? does a large complex metal sculpture require only one sprue just like my tiny ring?

I can't add anything to the 'miniatures' debate that hasn't already been stated. As much as I understand the position Shapeways are in, I'm sure they can understand why I will be looking elsewhere for a cheaper alternative (and if nothing turns up, I shall be crawling back).

I would like to know if we are to pay shipping fees can we assume our orders will arrive on time? Out of all the orders I've made with Shapeways an alarming amount have been delayed (some a few days, some weeks). It never bothered me because it was free, but once you put a price on something it becomes a service. People don't pay good money for poor service.

Depends on your definition of free. The minimum order was $25 before so that there was enough profit in the models to cover the shipping. And if you check the material status page, there are still a few that are working on fixing delays.

I don't understand this new CSV at all. I have downloaded it. On WSF models, it tells me that a 95cm3 model, price (column H) 75.63 is price Oct 1 (Column I) 39.53.

This hardly means that a €75 model has reduced in price to €39, so what is the figure in Column I for Oct 1, how is it calculated please?

Read nancy's post about the CSV here https://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=6549&a mp;start=0&
apparently there is a calculation error

I can see the majority of the responses in this thread are negative, I do hope Shapeways take note of this.

Many people built their businesses(Shops) around the old pricing scheme; To publish a set pricing structure and for several years actively encourage people to build businesses around it, then with almost no notice change the pricing structure which forms the core of peoples' shops and businesses is fundamentally wrong in my opinion.

I am really upset by this, Shapeways is built around a community of people who produce the models, without the people to produce the models Shapeways has no business. How can you change the fundamental structure which people have built businesses around?

How much will postage for Norway be with the new pricing structure? We are a European country, but Non-Eu.

I really hope we fall in the $9,50 category, $19,99 seems a bit stiff....

Regards, Hauk

Hey B1lancer (and everyone), we've been very aware of the sentiments towards the change, both positive and negative.

I know for certain members of the community it sucks. You've been using Shapeways, you've crafted your models and your shop, you've learned our website, you've figured out all the nuances of our pricing scheme. For some of you, its been close to 3 years that you've been doing this! Now we're jumping in and changing it on you. It's kinda like when your sandcastle gets kicked.

I'm sorry if it feels like we're all stomping around and pulling the rug out from under you. We don't like making people feel that way.

The change in pricing structure is something that needed to happen. When we started out (long before I spent my time at Shapeways) we had no idea how this idea would turn out exactly. My future team just knew that this 3D printing thing seemed incredible and wanted to open it up to people, which meant making it as inexpensive as possible. We set up a pricing structure that we hoped would make it easy for people make and order what they wanted, and it worked.

As we watched over time though, a few patterns started to emerge. Smaller items were beginning to cost Shapeways a lot of money, whereas larger items were bringing in an oversized margin. Ironically, smaller models were much more labor intensive. It got to be clear that larger models were subsidizing the smaller ones, which didn't seem fair. We needed to make sure that the cost of each model was being covered accurately.

Shapeways is the first company taking a crack at opening up 3D printing at this kind of scale, and creating a reliable supply chain for it. There are bound to be huge unknowns that we stumble across. By making changes in the short term, it makes us more able to innovate, and reach our core goal of driving prices back down (and then lowering them further...). I hope you can understand where we're coming from, and will stick around while we figure this out together.

.........and if the small pieces that this 'community' has produced generate 10% of the profits and 90% of the problems, just what would you suggest Shapeways should do?

It's much more than just Shapeways if I'm honest, it's the whole idea that profit goes before people; That seems to wrong to me. Yes a profit has to be made, but why can't a percentage of that profit be used to subsidise a community and help people?

It's far more upsetting because when I joined Shapeways I could see that many of the ways they did things were inefficient, but the company felt like the community and the platform they provided for small businesses were very much a valued element in the business.

But now many of the users will find their "Shops" inviable due to the price increases, not only does that mean a loss to them but also to their customers. It effects real people, not just stats on a piece of paper.

Now, to me at least, it feels like the community and platform for small businesses Shapeways provide isn't valued for the people, but valued financially as a USP or some other business "Buzzword".

Oh well, I guess Shapeways have to find someway to pay for their 5 million dollar New York HQ.

Kindest Regards,

Jack

Well I must agree it would have been nice to get a little more notice of the changes, but if the old price structure was not making money, then the business is not viable. And if the business is not viable then sooner or later it will not be trading any more and not only will Ana and the rest of the Shapeways crew be out on the streets but we will have no one to produce our beautiful models.

So to say that the current changes have destroyed your business is a fallacy. If the changes had not been made your business would have been dead at some point in the future anyway.

If we are trying to build serious businesses based on Shapeways(or indeed any other external service) we need to have sufficient flexibility and enough margin to absorb these sort of changes in costs.

On the other hand I do sometimes wish that Shapeways would tell us more about which bits of what are doing is good for them and which bits cause them problems. Most people here want Shapeways to succeed and will try and modify our designs to help - if we know what to do !

Tom

Thanks Tom,

You got it,

We are trying to give you all as much information as possible so that we can ensure we all optimize our work/processes/designs/shops together to make the most of the potential that online 3D printing provides.

I understand more advance notice in future would be appreciated, we will endeavor to do this.

Take a look at the recent blog post which refers to people building businesses off of online 3D printing, Seth Rodin sets the scene and Cory Doctorow really explores it in Makers, worth the read. Or if you are like me and reading is kinda hard to get done, you can get the audiobook.

Awesomeness.

Thanks all