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More in stainless [message #20236] Mon, 08 November 2010 16:45 UTC Go to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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The Step Twin D6 arrived!
Why the Step Twin?
Well, because it's the complimentary twin to my Stepped Die D6


http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/stepped-edge-d6/images/step-twin-2-sml.jpg


http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/stepped-edge-d6/images/step-twin-4-sml.jpg


I think this model is really pushing the boundaries in what can be acheived in stainless steel... the 1.2mm steps are only joined by 0.2mm strips and as can be seen the model is slightly skewed.

http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/stepped-edge-d6/images/step-twin-skew-sml.jpg


Also, in the same box...

http://www.shapeways.com/model/162900/]Twin rail mobius with ball pendant


http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/mobius/images/twin-rail-mobius-front-sml.jpg


http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/mobius/images/twin-rail-mobius-back-sml.jpg


The ball supplied with the model should have been 5mm diameter, it came in at about 4mm (by eye), so I grabbed a 6mm ball and retro-fitted it.

http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/mobius/images/twin-rail-mobius-front-retrofit-6mm-sml.jpg
Re: More in stainless [message #20242 is a reply to message #20236 ] Mon, 08 November 2010 17:28 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar GlenG  is currently offline GlenG
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Definitely a better idea to add you own ball! Better action, fewer failed prints. A glass ball might look sharp too.

-G


"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art."
Leonardo da Vinci
Re: More in stainless [message #20243 is a reply to message #20242 ] Mon, 08 November 2010 17:40 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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GlenG wrote on Mon, 08 November 2010 17:28

Definitely a better idea to add you own ball! Better action, fewer failed prints. A glass ball might look sharp too.

-G


Own ball is the way forward... from now on I'm making all my 'can-have-a-ball' models so they can take a 6mm ball of whatever material... and maybe some speciality steel printed balls too Wink
Re: More in stainless [message #20254 is a reply to message #20243 ] Mon, 08 November 2010 22:53 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar LincolnK  is currently offline LincolnK
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I came to the same conclusion about having balls in items. I still like trying to make it work fully printed, but for stuff that I sell directly to customers are working out better installing it myself.

These prints look very slick. Are they exactly the way they came from SW, or have you polished them?

Lincoln
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Re: More in stainless [message #20269 is a reply to message #20254 ] Tue, 09 November 2010 06:21 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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These models were fresh out the box from Shapeways photographed, no polishig at all Smile
Re: More in stainless [message #20270 is a reply to message #20269 ] Tue, 09 November 2010 06:25 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar LincolnK  is currently offline LincolnK
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Nice! They came out great.

Lincoln
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Re: More in stainless [message #20283 is a reply to message #20243 ] Tue, 09 November 2010 14:33 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar GlenG  is currently offline GlenG
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Why don't you try to insert some of those " Reuleaux Triangles" instead of spheres? The faceted surfaces of these shapes would add some flash and even more mystery.
-G


"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art."
Leonardo da Vinci
Re: More in stainless [message #20284 is a reply to message #20283 ] Tue, 09 November 2010 14:56 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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GlenG wrote on Tue, 09 November 2010 14:33

Why don't you try to insert some of those " Reuleaux Triangles" instead of spheres? The faceted surfaces of these shapes would add some flash and even more mystery.


Interersting idea! But the problem might be that such objects wouldn't smoothly roll along a track of wires, although maybe this is the point. If you put them on a flat surface and put a plate on top of them, they always have the same width, just like spheres. But if you tried to roll them down a gutter they would have to bounce around because there would be two points of contact on the sides rather than top and bottom.

How do you get the ball in there if it is not made as part of the object? I assume you have to force it in there?
Re: More in stainless [message #20290 is a reply to message #20284 ] Tue, 09 November 2010 18:52 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar GlenG  is currently offline GlenG
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Yeah, i guess they would sort of roll along their edges not their surfaces? Might not work then. I'm sort of spatially challenged when it comes to visualizing forms in motion. That's why I prefer working with hand & hammers over computers.

-G


"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art."
Leonardo da Vinci
Re: More in stainless [message #20291 is a reply to message #20236 ] Tue, 09 November 2010 19:03 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Youknowwho4eva  is currently offline Youknowwho4eva
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Couldn't it work with a 4 barred system? the width and hieght would always be the same right? A 3 bar wouldn't because they don't stay consistent at 120 degrees.


I learned a long time ago the wisest thing I can do is be on my own side, be an advocate for myself and others like me. -Maya Angelou
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Re: More in stainless [message #20340 is a reply to message #20236 ] Wed, 10 November 2010 22:35 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar clsn  is currently offline clsn
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Actually, I can't see a problem with using surfaces of constant width like Reuleaux triangles and such. The whole point of a sphere is that it can't escape because it always needs at least space "d" to slip through—and so does any surface of constanr width. The smoothness of rolling doesn't really enter into it, especially since that mostly relates to the height of the center of the object, and nothing is attached to the center.

Whatever; I think it should work.
Re: More in stainless [message #20466 is a reply to message #20340 ] Sat, 13 November 2010 17:53 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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A little update;

I bought in some 6mm chrome steel ball bearings and fitted 31 into my Twin rail mobius pendant. The balls really help accentuate the shape of the pendant.

http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/mobius/images/twin-rail-mobius-front-retrofit-6mmx31-sml.jpg
Re: More in stainless [message #20468 is a reply to message #20466 ] Sat, 13 November 2010 18:00 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar virtox is currently online virtox
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Very Happy

[Updated on: Sat, 13 November 2010 18:01 UTC]


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Re: More in stainless [message #20488 is a reply to message #20466 ] Sun, 14 November 2010 20:28 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar GlenG  is currently offline GlenG
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Niiiiice!
Cobalt blue glass balls would be amazing too.


"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art."
Leonardo da Vinci
Re: More in stainless [message #20492 is a reply to message #20488 ] Sun, 14 November 2010 22:42 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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GlenG wrote on Sun, 14 November 2010 20:28

Niiiiice!
Cobalt blue glass balls would be amazing too.


Cheers Smile
[adds cobalt blue glass balls to wifey's friend's skills shopping list]
Re: More in stainless [message #20495 is a reply to message #20492 ] Sun, 14 November 2010 23:46 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar pete  is currently offline pete
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Please make a video and share it with your model! Very curious to see how it would look moving!
Re: More in stainless [message #20503 is a reply to message #20495 ] Mon, 15 November 2010 09:31 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Done.

Twin Rail Mobius pendant with balls! Wink
Re: More in stainless [message #20506 is a reply to message #20488 ] Mon, 15 November 2010 12:03 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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GlenG wrote on Sun, 14 November 2010 20:28

Niiiiice!
Cobalt blue glass balls would be amazing too.


How about blue steel balls?

http://www.stop4stuff.com/shapeways/mobius/images/twin-rail-mobius-front-retrofit-6mmx31-blued-sml.jpg

I heat treated some chrome steel balls to make them change colour... Video here
Re: More in stainless [message #20534 is a reply to message #20506 ] Mon, 15 November 2010 18:03 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar GlenG  is currently offline GlenG
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SWEET


"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art."
Leonardo da Vinci
Re: More in stainless [message #20535 is a reply to message #20534 ] Mon, 15 November 2010 18:23 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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GlenG wrote on Mon, 15 November 2010 18:03

SWEET



Cheers Glen.

My wife just got in from work and told me I'll be getting a few sample cobalt blue glass balls when her friend can fit them into her schedule in the next few weeks.
Re: More in stainless [message #20538 is a reply to message #20236 ] Mon, 15 November 2010 19:23 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Shuggster  is currently offline Shuggster
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Very cool dude.
Re: More in stainless [message #20540 is a reply to message #20535 ] Mon, 15 November 2010 19:45 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Thanks for making the video! Its already tweeted about Wink
Re: More in stainless [message #20552 is a reply to message #20283 ] Tue, 16 November 2010 02:02 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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GlenG wrote on Tue, 09 November 2010 14:33

Why don't you try to insert some of those " Reuleaux Triangles" instead of spheres? The faceted surfaces of these shapes would add some flash and even more mystery.
-G


If it helps, try these out. They are not technically surfaces of constant width, they're just intersections of spheres, but the difference between them and true Meissner bodies ought to be insignificant at this scale. There are 36 in this item.
Re: More in stainless [message #38439 is a reply to message #20540 ] Sat, 12 November 2011 08:13 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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One Year later...

The video Twin Rail mobius pendant with balls! is now getting about 9k views per day... and this is translating to 70-90 model page views per day, but no recent reported sales Sad

Does anyone have any pointers how I can (or what I might need to change) to increase the sales?

Cheers,
Paul
Re: More in stainless [message #38441 is a reply to message #38439 ] Sat, 12 November 2011 08:47 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar LincolnK  is currently offline LincolnK
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I don't know your background, so I don't know if you have a lot of experience selling jewelry or not.

I have been designing and selling jewelry for some time, and have found that people generally don't like buying a piece that requires any thing that isn't included. Even a lack of chain can, in many cases, kill sales. So since yours needs both the chain and the balls, my guess is that that is the reason for a lack of sales.

Another possibility is that people don't like to wait. So it's possible when they go to order it and realize that it could be a month before they get it, they give up.

Sadly, I don't have an easy solution for you since, obviously you can't include that stuff via shapeways. You could however get a bunch made, buy a bunch of chains, and bearings, put them together along with a gift box, and then sell them yourself.

You could put a link to your own site that sells them on your youtube page. Of course then you need to lay out a bunch of money, and keep stock as well as mail them out yourself. So, it is a lot more work.

Lincoln
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Re: More in stainless [message #38443 is a reply to message #20236 ] Sat, 12 November 2011 09:29 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar virtox is currently online virtox
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Novaking has good points there.

It's looks a bit too much DIY/experimental now.

And if you don't already have, I would put up a pack of matching (S&F) balls in your shop.

If you stack them closely with enough space and a mesh cube around it, it would make it easy for handling and shipping to make sure none go missing.

Perhaps also offer quarter/half-packs so people can mix and match colors.

The (short) description on your model page is a bit dry:
Quote:


A pendant incoporating a double mobius style loop to take a 6mm ball.

A 6mm steel (or other) ball bearing can be retrofitted, as seen in the default photo.
The updated model has a 4mm loop for attaching to a necklace.



And on youtube you also have an elaborate description where the link is not visible in the shortened version.

As far as I can tell from my experience, long and elaborate descriptions are not very useful in promotion and sales.

I recommend adding only the following line to the youtube video description:

"Info and purchasing: http://shpws.me/D6g"

And remix your current descriptions to a short and snappy one.
Perhaps followed by the more in depth description below the more button and a separate <h1> heading or similar.

I think the first four lines of text are crucial to making a sale or stir interest.

A twin-rail mobius pendant<br>
An endless and mind-warping cage for a train of 6 mm ball-bearings. Or better yet, or get the colored </link>supermarbles</link><br>

<h1>
What why how.
Etc

And then read it back as if you are completely new or find someone who is Wink
Do the sentences read swiftly?
Is it to the point?
Does it say what you mean to say?

Cheers!

[Updated on: Sat, 12 November 2011 09:30 UTC]


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Re: More in stainless [message #38476 is a reply to message #38443 ] Sun, 13 November 2011 05:52 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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novaking & virtox, thank you for the tips Smile

Carrying stock is something I am trying to steer away from, but it is looking like I must go that way to succeed!

@virtox, the long & elaborate youtube description is for matching the keywords for advertising revenue purposes - I have added the short "Info and purchasing: http://shpws.me/D6g" so that it is the only thing visable before clicking more info Smile



Re: More in stainless [message #38529 is a reply to message #38476 ] Mon, 14 November 2011 13:20 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar jeff  is currently offline jeff
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Personally I'd like to see the design shown packed full of the stainless steel balls, and one brightly colored glass ball, like orange. Then you'd have a good reference for movement & rotation of the balls.

just sharing ideas...


Jeff Bare
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Re: More in stainless [message #38559 is a reply to message #38529 ] Mon, 14 November 2011 21:18 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Cheers Jeff, funnily enough a YouTube member commented the same but with a yellow ball earlier today. I wear this pendant on a daily basis with a single blue ball (+30 normal steel) and I do get comments about how effective it is.

Paul
Re: More in stainless [message #38562 is a reply to message #38559 ] Mon, 14 November 2011 21:34 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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@virtox @novaking Sounds like good advice.

One thing that always catches my eye whenever I'm browsing is products which are presented with some sort of story.

Doesn't have to be elaborate, but something that paints of picture of the product in the context of everyday life. For example, Paul, what inspired you to make this particular design? You say you wear it often. What have people's reactions to it been?




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Re: More in stainless [message #38568 is a reply to message #38562 ] Mon, 14 November 2011 21:46 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Hi Ana,

The inspiration for twin rail came from TerraCotta's One ring to rule the ball - Twin Rail is a take on that but with 6 3 wires that have loads of balls.

When I'm wearing the pendant, people's reaction vary from wtf to wow, where can I get one... but sadly as yet no one has walked up to me and said I've seen that on the internet as happened with one of my LEGO creations at an exhibition a few years ago.

Paul

[edit] call it what you want... maybe cynical, but, what kind of story need to be attached to a product? Surely, it is what it is, how do stories affect sales?

[Updated on: Mon, 14 November 2011 21:59 UTC]

Re: More in stainless [message #38576 is a reply to message #38568 ] Mon, 14 November 2011 22:53 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar LincolnK  is currently offline LincolnK
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I don't think "I was inspired by another artist's work" makes for a very meaningful story. So, I wouldn't go with that one.

Lincoln
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Re: More in stainless [message #38577 is a reply to message #38576 ] Mon, 14 November 2011 23:00 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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dunno how else to put it without fibbing and fibbing is not me

[Updated on: Mon, 14 November 2011 23:00 UTC]

Re: More in stainless [message #38587 is a reply to message #38577 ] Tue, 15 November 2011 00:12 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar ana  is currently offline ana
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@novaking, Agreed. Wink

@stop4stuff Certainly no one would want you to fib. Don't stress it if you don't have the perfect "story" to tell about this particular design. I just wonder if there's some written way to share what you think is so awesome about it, which helps others to understand why they NEED to get their hands on it.







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Re: More in stainless [message #38589 is a reply to message #38577 ] Tue, 15 November 2011 00:14 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I guess TerraCotta's description (from your link above) is about as good as they get - perhaps you can take inspiration from that as well. There's no fibbing there, just a little story and a great description of the product. Do you think it may be worth the $$ to hire a copywriter to put a description together for you?


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Re: More in stainless [message #38590 is a reply to message #38589 ] Tue, 15 November 2011 00:33 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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$ or £ are in short supply just now, I'll sleep on it, and to quote Hawkwind "...let's see what tomorrow brings" (from Hurry on Sundown)

Ana, Lincoln, Marcus & Stijn, thank you for your help.
Re: More in stainless [message #38608 is a reply to message #38590 ] Tue, 15 November 2011 10:57 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
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After some sleep and sunshine this morning, I think I cracked it Smile

Quote:

Inspired by the well known mobius strip (discovered by August Ferdinand Möbius in 1858), an interest in the unusual, and 3D modelling, I created the Twin Rail mobius pendant.

A half shell and 3 rails form a bearing-like structure to encapsulate a train of 6mm balls in a mind-warping cage with a twisting, fascinating movement bringing to life the only pendent of its kind in the world.

Includes a 4mm loop for attaching to a necklace or leather cord.

See the photographs with retro-fitted 31 6mm chrome steel ball bearings... in the bottom photo, the balls have been heated until they 'blue'... check out the video to see how they move by clicking on the little icon below the camera above.


Comments welcome.
Paul
Re: More in stainless [message #38625 is a reply to message #38577 ] Tue, 15 November 2011 17:33 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar GlenG  is currently offline GlenG
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Picasso once said something like:
"Mediocre artists borrow, great artists steal"

Meaning, it is a delusion to think that anything a person does is completely without influence or inspiration. How a person interprets, employs and expresses these messages will always separate the wheat from the chaff.

-G

[Updated on: Tue, 15 November 2011 17:47 UTC]


"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art."
Leonardo da Vinci
Re: More in stainless [message #41302 is a reply to message #38625 ] Fri, 06 January 2012 07:53 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Well, a couple of more month further on and I've lost count of the amount of sales for the Twin Rail mobius, but the video Twin Rail Mobius Pendant - with Balls! 3D printed metal @shapeways is fast approaching 1 million views with still a sustained 10k+ views per day.

I've made another video, Twin Rail Mobius Pendant - with Balls! - Answers., that answers some questions from the comments left on the first video. The good news is that 1/4 inch balls also fit!

As yet, I've not added a model for the balls, but an experimental 'ball dispenser' will be in my next order along with another mind bending mobius design Wink

Cheers,
Paul
Re: More in stainless [message #53419 is a reply to message #41302 ] Fri, 31 August 2012 11:45 UTC Go to previous messageGo to previous message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Well nearly eight more months have passed by, and my YouTube video, Twin Rail Mobius Pendant - with Balls! 3D printed metal @shapeways, has now had an astounding 2.6million views. Shocked

The view count fluctuates a bit from 2.5 to 8k per day, but its looking good for 3 million views by Christmas time Smile

Paul



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