why is render time...

Discussion in 'Bug Reporting' started by stop4stuff, Jul 10, 2012.

  1. stop4stuff
    stop4stuff Well-Known Member
    Why is model render time included in the 1800 seconds for model validation?

    This has caused me all sorts of headaches today. Fwiw, the excact same model can go through or fail - please can there be some cosistency with the ability to upload?

    Paul :cry:
  2. flypig
    flypig New Member
    It appears I've been suffering from the same problem today, so I'd like to add my voice to the suggestion of removing the image render from the timeout. As a related issue, it would also help to have a clearer error message that this is the reason for the failure. The error message I received simply said "The design could not be validated," which is not ideal for diagnosing where the problem lies.

    I'm very happy with the service otherwise - and the great support I received through the forum!

  3. natalia
    natalia New Member
    Hi guys,

    Can you tell me a bit more detail on this bug please?

    When exactly is it happening? At upload? This helps me get it fixed!

  4. flypig
    flypig New Member
    Hi Natalia,

    Thanks for following this up. This happens for me when I try to upload certain models, especially VRML files with colour values assigned to nodes.

    Although I believe the model is okay, after some time I receive an error message by email like the one attached.

    The problem appears to be a combination of model complexity and colour/VRML, since the model uploads fine without colour as an STL file, or if I lower the polygon count.

    It's notable that previously the Shapeways software has managed to calculate the cost correctly, but the image didn't get rendered, making it seem like the problem occurred during the render stage (which tallies with what Paul suggests in his email).

    Thanks again for looking into this. It would be great if there's a fix, since I guess it would allow for better quality prints to be created.


    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  5. flypig
    flypig New Member
    Attached is an example file in case it's helpful for testing.

    Also, here's an example of the resulting object page, with the correct cost but without an image render:


    Sorry for not adding this to my previous email, but this is to circumvent the maximum of one file per message.


    Attached Files:

  6. stop4stuff
    stop4stuff Well-Known Member
    I downloaded the zip file, but alas the file once unpacked has no filetye extension - even adding .wrl to the filename creates an 'unknown type' error in Accutrans - perhaps this is part of the issue?

  7. flypig
    flypig New Member
    Thanks for trying the zipfile, but this is a bit odd, since it downloads and loads into Accutrans fine for me.

    It is possible this is the problem, but I feel it's unlikely since I use the same method to upload smaller models that work fine.

    I've made a new version and uploaded it to the Web in case it's getting scrambled by the forum. Would you mind trying this?

    http://www.flypig.co.uk/dnload/dnload/models/ProblemModel.zi p

    You should also be able to download the model from the broken model page: http://shpws.me/aYxu

    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  8. stop4stuff
    stop4stuff Well-Known Member
    Yep, that download worked just fine.

    The issue lays with the intersecting meshes, see image below. I chopped away all but the intersecting region where the tighter and less tight spirals cross. The tighter spiral is within the other mesh - the colour information pertains to the outer skins of the meshes and something along the way confuses Shapeways MeshMedic to the extent that the colour information gets disregarded when the meshes are merged - the only solution I've found to resolve this is to merge the meshes with NetFabb Cloud Service before colouring the model, but iirc this is not an option for you as the model is created and coloured 'on-the-fly'

  9. flypig
    flypig New Member
    That's impressive detective work! I can understand that the software could get confused where triangles cross, given that the colours are associated with nodes. However, it still seems odd to me that it works okay with a lower resolution version, but not with the high resolution mesh. They don't look that different to me (although my understanding is very limited unfortunately). What you say would seem to make sense though.

    Unfortunately you're also right that the mesh is coloured at the same time the vertex positions are generated, and unfortunately decoupling and then reapplying the colour is way beyond my 3D modelling capabilities! I'd love to be as proficient as other people clearly are on these boards!

    Given this, from my perspective it would (obviously!) be great if this is something that can be fixed at Shapeway's end, but I appreciate that this could be just a fundamentally difficult thing for the printing software to deal with. From your previous comments, my main concern was that this might be a problem with the rendering process rather than the printing process. If it's the former, it would seem a shame to reject models that are otherwise fine to print.


  10. stop4stuff
    stop4stuff Well-Known Member
    mmm... the plot deepens.

    You say the lower res model uploads fine, yet the higher res one fails - in all probability this is down to the time out on the render side of things, are you able to get somewhere inbetween for resolution and try that?

  11. natalia
    natalia New Member
    Hey guys...hmmm, let me see if I can get any more clues into this over the weekend, if not, I'm taking it to the wizards in Tech on Monday!

    Good sleuthing so far though...
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2012
  12. tonysw
    tonysw New Member
    Hi Paul,

    Can you attach the model that you've been trying to upload so I can see the exact error you've been getting?

    FYI: I was able to upload flypig's ProblemModel.wrl. The image rendering timed out, but the model did eventually show up in my account and I did not get the problem email.
  13. stop4stuff
    stop4stuff Well-Known Member
    Hi tsw,

    Unfortunately I cannot attach my client's model files publically and they are too big to send in a PM, the models did eventually upload ok at an earlier time of (the next) day when it's probable that there was less load on on Shapeways systems. I'll PM you a link to the model page.