The giant has awakened.. 3D systems lunches

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by dizingof, Jan 8, 2012.

  1. dizingof
    dizingof New Member
    3D systems scheduled to launch in 2 days..

    The website will sell a home 3D printer...(looks like the UP! printer)
    plus offer shapeways-like shops for designers to sell and profit from their designs.. while they take care of the production on their vast line of 3D printers... and-kinect-app-to-ces/

  2. dizingof
    dizingof New Member
  3. TomZ
    TomZ New Member
    I think the video misrepresents the print quality. They say the glove is printed using their "cloud service", so it looks like it was not made on a Cube printer but on a professional machine (if I dare take a guess, it looks like SLS to me). Same thing goes for the shoe, it's way too smooth to be made by FDM.
    Still, I'm excited for this printer and hope that the consumables won't be too expensive. I wonder how the quality compares to the higher-end homebrew systems like MakerBot and Ultimaker.
  4. Youknowwho4eva
    Youknowwho4eva Shapeways Employee Community Team
    I'm watching without audio, but I agree that the glove shoe and belt couldn't be made on this printer. No support material.
  5. amph
    amph New Member
    Just wow...!!!

    Seems to early, but this is finally gonna be a game changer!

    Any technical details?? (resolution, etc...'))))
  6. TomZ
    TomZ New Member
    The Cubify site just launched. The price will indeed be $1300 but they're not taking orders right now.

    The layer thicknes is 0.125mm. This is far better than what uPrint offers (0.254mm) and even beats the Dimension Elite (0.178mm).
    The maximal build size is 14cm cubed. The support material is the same as the model material, by printing it thinner and faster it becomes possible to break it away from the model.
    This is even better than WSF (!) which has 0.15mm layers. Judging from the pictures though, the print quality is a lot less even though the layers might be thinner.

    The material comes in "cases" of $50 each or $140 for 3. I can't find any spec on how much material is actually inside a case.
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2012
  7. amph
    amph New Member
    just watched the ultimaker specs, and just destroy the cube 3d printer.
    Not a game changer at all..
  8. dizingof
    dizingof New Member
    Well... Shapeways can certainly have a big sigh of relief ... :)

    I seriously thought there was going to be a slaughter here but from what i can see for now It's going to take them a lot of time.. to catch up ...

    They have a human reviewer for each model uploaded not an automated system - when a model is approved it gets the 3DP mark as in "ready to 3d print and sell".

    @amph when looking for a 3D printer - price aside - ask yourself if you prefer a kit or a fully assembled , tested and fully calibrated one...

  9. fx
    fx Well-Known Member
    I don't understand what their target is. They are showing a kid on some pictures, but they sell a machine with parts that get very hot ...

    The website is also rather confusing. The whole idea behind is indeed interesting, but they put too many different things into only one website IMHO. Strangely, uploading a STL to get a quote doesn't seem to be possible...
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2012
  10. TomZ
    TomZ New Member
    I've uploaded an STL but it does absolutely nothing. It just sits here. The volume and bounding box fields remain empty.
    You can actually offer the files for sale so people can print your models on their own printer. You get to pick your own sales price but they're taking 40% of the money.

    Of the printable models, none can actually be ordered and you can't get a price either but it does show two materials: strong white plastic and glossy white plastic. Would that be SLS and SLA respectively, or maybe FDM and SLA?

    Of course, I wouldn't trust my files to this service, given that buyers will be able to download them and print out as many copies as they want to give to their friends or even put my files up on Pirate Bay.

    I am interested though to get a quote for printing my own models, but I can't find any way to request validation of my file. I wonder if they'll look at it without any action on my side.

    Finally, uploading a model is a lot of work, you have to enter a plethora of field and change two settings from default so it remains unlisted. Not a Shapeways killer by any means, yet.

    Maybe they'll try to win us over by offering successful shopkeepers a free printer? That'd be nice :laughing:
  11. duann
    duann New Member
    Yeah, poked around and could not get the site to accept my files.

    Looks like they pushed the site liver before it was ready so they could launch at CES...

  12. amph
    amph New Member

    When looking for a 3d printer I'll look for resolution, I don't care if the kit is fully assembles and calibrated if the resolution is crap....for me models with this stair stepping are just not usefull.
    I think i'll wait....

    For me this cube 3d printer is not good enough.
  13. Tamert
    Tamert New Member
    People always forget how much of a headache equipment management and upkeep can be.

    For me the value of shapeways is that I can entirely offload the manufacturing process. I don't have to purchase equipment, I don't have to be a technical expert in operating and troubleshooting the equipment or hire someone else to do that, I don't have to replace the equipment once it's obsolete, and I don't have to stock consumable for the equipment. All of this costs tons of cash, time, and mental capital.

    To make up this amount of money, I feel like you'd have to build a huge number of models using this printer. And since it's a FDM process the build quality will be poor for all but very specific classes of objects. This thing looks like a toy rather than a real product. If it was ~$200 I'd consider getting one for the kids to play with but that is about it.

  14. LincolnK
    LincolnK New Member
    I don't want a home 3D printer to take the place of shapeways.

    I agree with the last post. I don't want to be a manufacturing facility.

    But, I'd love to have a good 3D printer at home to prototype and work out my designs before sending them to SW. It was save me money (perhaps), but more importantly, it would save me time.

    Waiting 2 weeks or more to see if a design worked is really slowing down what I could do with my products. Some times when my order arrives, I don't even remember which designs I ordered because at home I have already moved on to working on new designs.

    Still, I don't know that this printer is quite what I'm looking for in quality. It is exciting that there are so many choices for under $2K now compared to just a while ago. It makes me think that something that will have the right price and quality for my needs may be available within the next couple of years.

  15. stannum
    stannum Well-Known Member
    0.15 is one of the worst modes for WSF machines, probably the one used when people complained about visible lines. Anyway, FDM layers are more visible because they are continuous lines, while dust based systems confuse the eyes a bit thanks to the smaller particle size and the random order they take to form each layer.
  16. Tamert
    Tamert New Member

    When I need speed I use more expensive services like zoomrp or solid concepts. Might be helpful for you. They offer identical products as shapeways just faster for a price premium.

  17. LincolnK
    LincolnK New Member
    Thanks Tamert,

    I am familiar with zoom, but not the other one. I had looked into them before, and the price is sometimes as much as 10 times more expensive than shapeways. That is too much for the projects I have been working on so far, so I have just elected to wait the 2 weeks for my SW stuff.

    Also, having a printer in house for prototypes and size checks could mean in some cases only waiting a half hour to get the print back. Even places that say they print and mail it out the same day can't beat that speed. :)

    Have you been happy with the quality of the pieces from those other companies?

  18. Tamert
    Tamert New Member
    Extremely. Generally their fit and finish is substantially better than shapeways. I think that is where the price premium comes from.

    Generally solid concepts is 2.5x shapeways but I have never received a bad print from them that myself and others have received from the shapeways FUD. They have also been on time with every print so far. My last order before Christmas from shapeways was ~15 business days late or 3 weeks.

    The pricing from zoomrp seems very random to me. I haven't figured out their algorithm. Sometimes it's 2x shapeways, othertimes it's 10x shapeways.

    There maybe other suppliers with better pricing. These are just the ones that I have used.
  19. TomZ
    TomZ New Member
    Well, the prices at Cubify are not cheap either. A random 37 cm3 model costs $250 in white strong plastic, versus $50 or so at Shapeways. What are they thinking?
  20. dizingof
    dizingof New Member
    No doubt they have a serious pricing bug .. strangely i made sales of my Gyroid XL model

    Only there is no page to check the sales data and payments etc..

    It received the "3D print" icon.. meaning its printable with their service .. but for both available plastics the prices are $1107.. and $736.. :eek:

    So i assume customers bought my stl file which isn't so good... :confused