http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php Shapeways: Bring your creativity to life in 3D http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29570&th=5627#msg_29570
I know many of you guys are waiting urgently for the word on FUD. You haven't seen a big announcement today because we're still in our final hours of negotiation. We'll be back tomorrow with news that we hope you'll be happy with.

Sorry to keep you hanging any longer, but an answer is on its way!

Thanks,
Ana]]> ana 2011-06-23T21:28:44-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29572&th=5627#msg_29572 tebee 2011-06-23T21:43:07-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29582&th=5627#msg_29582 ]]> SierraStudios 2011-06-24T04:40:56-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29584&th=5627#msg_29584 kakapoopie 2011-06-24T05:27:01-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29605&th=5627#msg_29605 ]]> roundmountaingroup 2011-06-24T16:33:17-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29607&th=5627#msg_29607 In NYC they just had their lunch!
So they have some hours left!

Cheers
Mitchell Jetten

from Europe]]> Jettuh 2011-06-24T16:43:15-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29610&th=5627#msg_29610
Details are here.

Whew!

]]> ana 2011-06-24T17:15:34-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29611&th=5627#msg_29611
it eliminates 50% of the items i was planning on making by increasing their price by 800 % in some cases...
]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T17:21:09-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29616&th=5627#msg_29616
Is that $5.00 per model? Or is it for an order of multiple designs or an order of say 10 prints of one design?

Thanks!

]]> roundmountaingroup 2011-06-24T17:37:59-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29617&th=5627#msg_29617
For the moment a great suggestion for you is to group some models in a single stl file (or other format)
this way you have to order just 1 model wich contains multiple models inside it!
And you only pay the startup costs once

Please do note that Shapeways probably will make a maximum parts per file rule in the future!]]> Jettuh 2011-06-24T17:47:41-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29618&th=5627#msg_29618 ]]> tebee 2011-06-24T17:52:46-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29619&th=5627#msg_29619
I guess I am surprised that the wall thicknesses of .3mm for FUD is remaining? Thought it might have caused a lot of misprints etc but hey, good to go.

Woot? WOOT!

Doh, sorry, you guys beat me to the punch x2 as I was still replying. ]]> Nane 2011-06-24T17:58:53-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29620&th=5627#msg_29620 tebee wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 17:52
... but if they do make a maximum number of parts per file then you have to join all your parts with small sprues


at least with FUD those sprues can be pretty thin
]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T17:59:30-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29621&th=5627#msg_29621 Nane 2011-06-24T18:01:04-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29622&th=5627#msg_29622 SierraStudios 2011-06-24T18:01:38-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29623&th=5627#msg_29623
So has anyone done the math on the cost of how large a new order has to be to swallow the $5 startup fee vs. the old prices? I'm terrible at math, just wondering at what price point do you start to see the value of the new cost.

]]> Nane 2011-06-24T18:08:25-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29624&th=5627#msg_29624 SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T18:16:30-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29625&th=5627#msg_29625 Now for me it's clear: Selling on eBay is the way to go. Stuffing a lot of parts in one STL file only works when I repackage my things and sell them there...
]]> fx 2011-06-24T18:18:56-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29627&th=5627#msg_29627 fx wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 18:18
Also this way too high startup kills completely my whole product line here on Shapeways. Now for me it's clear: Selling on eBay is the way to go. Stuffing a lot of parts in one STL file only works when I repackage my things and sell them there...



same here. would have much preferred a price increase than a startup fee.]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T18:25:37-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29628&th=5627#msg_29628 phildlight 2011-06-24T18:31:23-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29629&th=5627#msg_29629 New FUD $3.49 +$5.00
So the first 5.6 cm3 will absorb the startup cost. Anything after benefits from the new discount. So that means the order needs to be $19.55 or more to absorb the new startup cost.

I think. Sorry, I hate math....

For the miniatures I am looking to have printed it looks like this benefits me as they will most of the time exceed $30 each. Single minis that don't I can group together no problem.]]> Nane 2011-06-24T18:33:06-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29630&th=5627#msg_29630 SierraStudios 2011-06-24T18:34:41-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29631&th=5627#msg_29631
But look at it from Shapeways point of view, it cost them a certain amount to process each order - some one has to do the accounts. pay the Paypal fees and pack it into its box. Don't forget that all the nice pieces of packing that keeps it safe are not free.

I think the way to get around this is two pronged. Offer the item on Shapeways site singly so people can buy from here if the want to but also buy some yourself in bulk and re-sell on eBay or wherever

Then you can use the higher cost of the item on here to justify a higher price on eBay and help offset some of those extra costs. ]]> tebee 2011-06-24T18:42:14-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29632&th=5627#msg_29632
1:6 scale knife model printed in FUD:
old price: 44 cents.
new price: $5.35....

my intended selling price after painting and finishing work $5.00

profit margin:
old pricing :about $3 per knife

new pricing : negative $ 1.91

that doesn't even factor in all the time i wasted working on dozens of models that i now won't have any way to sell at a price that is reasonable....

]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T18:54:04-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29633&th=5627#msg_29633 tebee wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 18:42
The break even point is is about 10 cm3 so it's not an horrendous amount more except for the very small models.


Old FUD $4.39 x 5.5cm3 = $24.15
New FUD $3.49 x 5.5cm3 +$5 = $24.20
So the break even point I think is 5.5 cm3

Quote:

But look at it from Shapeways point of view, it cost them a certain amount to process each order - some one has to do the accounts. pay the Paypal fees and pack it into its box. Don't forget that all the nice pieces of packing that keeps it safe are not free.

Agreed, especially when SOME crazy person orders .3mm ringed chainmail!

SIXTHSCALE wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 18:54

that doesn't even factor in all the time i wasted working on dozens of models that i now won't have any way to sell at a price that is reasonable....

You might be able to do collected 1/6 sets of knives, swords, guns, grenades etc. I know it isn't ideal to what you wanted but weapon packs are quite common in the 1/6 world so it may not look so bad to your customers. Your customers could benefit from exclusive designs not to mention the product not being out of stock or the plague of the 1/6 world, limited sets then they are gone for good.]]> Nane 2011-06-24T19:03:15-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29634&th=5627#msg_29634 RogersX wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 19:03

SIXTHSCALE wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 18:54

that doesn't even factor in all the time i wasted working on dozens of models that i now won't have any way to sell at a price that is reasonable....

You might be able to do collected 1/6 sets of knives, swords, guns, grenades etc. I know it isn't ideal to what you wanted but weapon packs are quite common in the 1/6 world so it may not look so bad to your customers. Your customers could benefit from exclusive designs not to mention the product not being out of stock or the plague of the 1/6 world, limited sets then they are gone for good.


true... but my cost per prototype just increased by 800% in many cases... so instead of ordering 20 or 25 different prototypes in a $25 dollar order... i can now order 4 or 5.

it's almost entirely not worth it.
]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T19:18:08-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29635&th=5627#msg_29635
I think we were very lucky to get a break while this material was experimental that allowed us to order small things very cheaply and give us the ability to try many things - I'm sure Shapeways was not making a profit on some of them.

And we don't want Shapeways to go bust, do we guys?.........

But more than that - if you have a business strategy that relies on item X being available from supplier Z at price-point Z you are courting disaster.

One of the major abilities you need to survive in business is to be adaptable and be able to respond to whatever the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune throw at you.

And if your not running this as a business why are you complaining? your new toy has just got more expensive - so just buy less of it or go figure a way to make more money so you can buy more of it. ]]> tebee 2011-06-24T19:24:59-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29636&th=5627#msg_29636 Quote:

true... but my cost per prototype just increased by 800% in many cases... so instead of ordering 20 or 25 different prototypes in a $25 dollar order... i can now order 4 or 5.

it's almost entirely not worth it.



Just put your 20 Prototypes together in one STL file then the cost may even be less. ]]> tebee 2011-06-24T19:27:27-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29637&th=5627#msg_29637 incredibly annoying. Because that renders the detail materials utterly useless to me. The $5.00 startup cost is enormous in comparison to the models I would (and have already) used it for.

The new price has basically increased the cost of the models by about 8 TIMES in some cases, and TurboCAD has a (unquantifiable) limit to the amount of detail it can convert across to .dxf before it just throws a wobbly.

A lot of the stuff I'd use FD for is a dollar or less (two or three at the outside; much more than that and it's cheaper to use SWF), so migitating that start-up cost to any degree per model would require probably ten-twelve models per pack. Which is not only too many for just one type (meaning it becomes more difficult to prototype), but also likely to run smack into TurboCAD's nebulous I-won't-convert-to-.dxf-tantrum limits. Hell, I can't get four cruisers in a pack, I'm never going to get eight plus corvettes. (I struggled with my last batch of fricken' fighters, because they were all curves.) And by that point, it's become way more expensive than SWF. The extra resolution is simply not even close to worth paying twice the extra. (Once painted, you have to look hard to tell the difference between two models I have, one in SWF an one in FD).

Case in point:



The two vessels with the red missile pods on pylons. One is SWF, one is FD. Can you tell which is which? I'm not even sure myself. You have to pick the models up and peer at 'em even when you have 'em in hand to tell which one is the supposedly better material.

It's really annoying, since the previous price was excellent. Heck, I wouldn't have minded it going up per cm by a modest amount, but that start-up fee is just way too much.

I certainly won't be ordering anything else in FD or FUD at that price.

That's a huge let-down Shapeways. I'm disappointed in you, especially considering the enormous amount of demand for the material. Doubly so after I spent the last three wargames conventions singing your praises about how Shapeways was revolutionising the wargames model industry and becoming competative with metal castings. You dropped the ball on this one, guys.]]> AotrsCommander 2011-06-24T19:28:25-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29638&th=5627#msg_29638 tebee wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 19:24
Packing multiple items together seems to be the way to go.

I think we were very lucky to get a break while this material was experimental that allowed us to order small things very cheaply and give us the ability to try many things - I'm sure Shapeways was not making a profit on some of them.

And we don't want Shapeways to go bust, do we guys?.........

But more than that - if you have a business strategy that relies on item X being available from supplier Z at price-point Z you are courting disaster.

One of the major abilities you need to survive in business is to be adaptable and be able to respond to whatever the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune throw at you.

And if your not running this as a business why are you complaining? your new toy has just got more expensive - so just buy less of it or go figure a way to make more money so you can buy more of it.


yes you need to be adaptable.... but asking people to adapt to a 20 or 50 % price increase is one thing....an 800% increase is a totally differrent scale of problem...

it's now cheaper for me to print many items in steel than it is in FUD.
]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T19:30:04-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29639&th=5627#msg_29639 tebee wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 19:27

Quote:

true... but my cost per prototype just increased by 800% in many cases... so instead of ordering 20 or 25 different prototypes in a $25 dollar order... i can now order 4 or 5. it's almost entirely not worth it.

Just put your 20 Prototypes together in one STL file then the cost may even be less.



i have doubts that my software can even do that without crashing]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T19:33:19-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29640&th=5627#msg_29640 know mine can't.]]> AotrsCommander 2011-06-24T19:37:25-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29641&th=5627#msg_29641
i've been enthusiastically promoting shapeways to everyone in the 1:6 hobby... right now i'm not seeing much reason to do so any more.

i love the potential it has, and the shapeways community vibe is great.... but i'm feeling a bit disillusioned at the moment.
]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T19:53:53-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29642&th=5627#msg_29642 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r1CZTLk-Gk]]> phildlight 2011-06-24T19:55:00-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29643&th=5627#msg_29643 Aotrs Commander wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 19:28

I certainly won't be ordering anything else in FD or FUD at that price.

Well like you said you can still do WSF. I'd say that is a positive from your comparisons of the two on the game table.

Quote:

That's a huge let-down Shapeways. I'm disappointed in you, especially considering the enormous amount of demand for the material. Doubly so after I spent the last three wargames conventions singing your praises about how Shapeways was revolutionising the wargames model industry and becoming competative with metal castings. You dropped the ball on this one, guys.

I don't know, I think that is a little too harsh. It was a trial period i.e. test period with X amount of unknowns and customer variables. That is the reason why I did not order but sat back and followed all FUD related news. I was actually semi-worried the price was too low and after the trial period might be a little too high (not to mention misprints, sticking support material, overall detail/quality etc). Now that it is set, I think I am ready to jump in.

I feel bad for those who were banking on this to be near similar or same concerning price but in the end it was a trial period. I don't think Shapeways is out to "get" anyone or price gouge them, since the prices for the rest of their materials is fair and I think it can be presumed the same care and attention in setting the final costs of FD and FUD were the same applied to those in the past. I can understand disappointment (who doesn't) but it was that same worry about cost that kept me from getting my hopes too high until the price was official.



]]> Nane 2011-06-24T20:10:18-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29644&th=5627#msg_29644
So if I have model A, B, C & D and order one of each in one order, do just pay the $5 once or do I pay it 4 times, so $20 in total?

If it is the latter, the reasoning behind it is quite strange. The advantage of a material like FUD is that you can design & produce very small and detailed models. If you add a mark-up this way, that advantage disappears ...

And then for Shapeways customers. For us, the primary customers it is fine to add more models in one STL. For the secondary customers, the ones that do not do the designs themselves but just order from the shops, it will be an impossible task.

And if the solution is to combine a lot of parts in one STL, why can't that be automated in the order process before Shapeways sends it to the 3D-printing companies?

And also, if we all start combining orders in one STL, Shapeways will run into the same issues again. They will not earn the necessary cost via the intended start-up fee.

So, this does not seem to be the way to go ...

Cheers,

Jeroen


PS: You do not have to add sprues to combine several stl files in one - it can even simply be done with netfabb studio (freeware) , without crashing your PC ... ]]> Spoors 2011-06-24T20:21:56-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29645&th=5627#msg_29645 free Netfabb Studio we are recommended to for checking wall thicknesses is capable of grouping STL files together I think.

Just open the first file, go to part/add to add the next one then part/move so they don't occupy the same space. Repeat as often as needed, than save as whatever.]]> tebee 2011-06-24T20:26:59-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29646&th=5627#msg_29646 scalar level, but not a massive hike up like this. (I mean, what amounts to a [B]400-800%/B] increase?)

After spending a great deal of time and effort saying how great Shapeways has been to everyone, and how it's the way forward for wargames miniatures, I'm just kinda torqued that Shapeways have basically priced a material that would have been useful and competative to the wargames model industry as a whole right out of the potential market, especially since I'd made a point of mentioning it.

Besides, if we don't give Shapeways some honest feedback, how will they know when they bog it up? (Or don't bog it up!)

Anyway, I've said my piece, hopefully when it will be at least noted in passing, so I won't rant any further.]]> AotrsCommander 2011-06-24T20:34:59-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29648&th=5627#msg_29648
While I myself can deal with my own prototypes for personal use, and make good use of FUD, I see no circumstance where I could economically offer such models for general sale, particularly if the buyer destroys their expensive purchase trying to remove the sticky residue.

For now, I will stick with polished WSF, which so far I am immensely happy with.]]> Bunrattypark 2011-06-24T20:43:01-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29649&th=5627#msg_29649
The start up cost covers the clean-up costs, which for us designers who can create files with multiple models sprued or stringed together, this is not an issue. The start-up cost factors in when a small model is ordered by an outside customer... will they order, or won't they?

Form my stanpoint, I'm of the mind that creating a 'model' comprising of several individual small models, grouped together makes sense for customer orders and many prototypes sprued together makes sense for my own orders.

The above applies to FUD only.

FD is (imo) more fragile than WD or TD and doesn't warrant the cost, but there is another issue with WD & TD that's printer based... the model needs to be of a resolution to make the printer comply with the surfaces - create a model with big faces and the chances are that in WD (at least) there will be major stepping even on flat srufaces.

I've had models in all of the materials asides from glass, and for detail, FUD wins over everything... 'we' have just got to accept the rules and not take the mickey.

Shapeways are learning and adapting to their new materials, we should take a step back and do the same too.

]]> stop4stuff 2011-06-24T20:43:26-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29650&th=5627#msg_29650 Spoors 2011-06-24T20:49:32-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29651&th=5627#msg_29651 AotrsCommander 2011-06-24T20:56:28-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29652&th=5627#msg_29652 Spoors wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 20:49
Right ... however Jettuh noted that Shapeways probably will make a maximum parts per file rule in the future ...


The FUD chain maille I received had 192 parts (see; FUDtastic), I've also received WSF chain maille items with many more parts... the limit is the the number of triangles... the number of parts is how they're joined and what work is creates in the after print process... just be creative how the parts are joined/linked together

]]> stop4stuff 2011-06-24T20:58:50-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29657&th=5627#msg_29657
i was hoping to wait for my previous order to arrive first to see how well black detail did as a possible substitute on detailed models... but it's been over 3 weeks

short on funds this weekend but i guess i'm making an order.

]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-24T23:22:57-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29660&th=5627#msg_29660
Adding multiple models to a single file is super easy. In ASCII STL files you can do it easily in notepad by cut and pasting the triangle info from each to a single file. For binary STL files I wrote a program to do it on my server but I am pretty sure netfabb can do it and the program is free.

As long as you keep under 1,000,000 triangles you can add as much to the file as you want. If the new resulting model is more then 5.5cm^3 then you will save money with new pricing.

I do this all the time to save customers $2.50 per model in WSF.


For those of you that buy paint then resell this will make your costs cheaper. For those that let the customer buy on shapeways this will make more expensive unless your customers are willing to buy bulk packs.

If anyone out there has a webserver and a bit of programming knowledge send me a message and we can negotiate a fair price for the code to render a group pack, and upload to shapeways so the customer can buy it.]]> mctrivia 2011-06-24T23:55:54-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29662&th=5627#msg_29662
And how am I supposed to go nest a bunch of models into a single file? I have no idea how many of each my customers want, except that it's usually one copy of 3-4 designs, and it's always a different configuration. And I don't want to tie up my money in maintaining inventory and having to ship boxes direct to customers, along with increased communications. Shapeways' pricing already takes that into consideration.

The entire point of the store here is to automate this process as much as possible.

Thanks for shutting me down AGAIN!.]]> dymihail 2011-06-25T00:28:24-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29667&th=5627#msg_29667 fx wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 18:18
Also this way too high startup kills completely my whole product line here on Shapeways. Now for me it's clear: Selling on eBay is the way to go. Stuffing a lot of parts in one STL file only works when I repackage my things and sell them there...




Totally agreed. Just like WSF before and after it has start up cost.
Time to change the FUD items in my shop to Not for Sale...nobody will buy it with that pricing anyway... ]]> CGD 2011-06-25T02:06:22-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29706&th=5627#msg_29706
I see F(U)D as a material for making very complex pieces, with working parts inside (and that's all i'm designing with the material). The startup costs discourage making tiny loose parts that are hard to handle, which makes perfect business sense. I often wonder how the guys at the print shop do to find and package the correct pieces from a big print run, sounds like an annoying job to do.

Implementing a limit on loose pieces per file could work, as an increased number of loose pieces complicates handling and cleaning, but probably should be done with a soft limit and rejection in a case by case basis. Say, allow the guy who wants to print a chain mail that wont be a huge hassle, but deny/split orders on the guy who wants to print a thousand knives without a support mesh (that will make the guys at the shop want to shoot them at somebody)

3D printing not only involves art, it also requires careful engineering and business thinking Something i noticed in the material sheet of fud is that it allows a 50 micron gap between loose parts, and some people took that literally and found out it's not possible to clean that well. That's info that should be added.

XD okay now i'm rambling, i think i'll better stop typing now :3]]> cyborg_ar 2011-06-25T22:09:22-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29711&th=5627#msg_29711 mctrivia 2011-06-26T01:56:11-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29715&th=5627#msg_29715
unfortunately the new pricing makes the material economically unfit for that purpose.

]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-26T02:18:58-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29716&th=5627#msg_29716 SIXTHSCALE wrote on Sun, 26 June 2011 02:18
But what FUD does work extremely well for is making small scale detailed items without having to sacrifice proportions to meet thick wall requirements....

unfortunately the new pricing makes the material economically unfit for that purpose.




So what you're saying is that FD/FUD now serves no purpose whatsoever.

Want durability? Go with Metal or Strong&Flexible.

Want detail? Go X-Detail.

So what does FUD offer? Detail comparable to X-Detail, but with smaller wall thickness. Oh, yeah, at double the cost.

Pass.

Break even at ~5.5cm^3? Newsflash: If I have a model at 5.5cm^3, I'm already not going to print it in FD/FUD because it's simply too much. I know my customers. They're not going to pay $30 for a model that size.

So how big is 5.5cm^3? Ever play a table top wargame? Battletech or Warhammer? A "standard" sized fig is pushing 10cm^3. No one is going to pay $40 for that. Oh, that's right, that's the manufacturing cost. Forget about any mark-up.

The ONLY thing FUD had going for it was detail with small wall thickness requirements. Almost by definition this means small, detailed parts. And you guys just priced yourself out. I keep looking for excuses to work with Shapeways, and they keep looking for ways to push me to Ponoko.]]> dymihail 2011-06-26T02:38:35-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29718&th=5627#msg_29718 Quote:


So how big is 5.5cm^3? Ever play a table top wargame? Battletech or Warhammer? A "standard" sized fig is pushing 10cm^3. No one is going to pay $40 for that. Oh, that's right, that's the manufacturing cost. Forget about any mark-up.




Normally I would be leading the charge with torches and pitchforks in the argument against the new FUD charges, but I am going to go against you on this one. I happen to have a couple Galaxies worth of Ral Partha and Ironwind Metals Battletech figures on my desk and random shelves around the house. I can tell you one thing for certain, they are NOT about 10cm^3 worth of material. They might be pushing 6 or 7. And I would gladly pay the almost $30 that it would cost for a highly detailed and accurate miniature. It gets kind of old painting the same minis time and time again and there are times when I would pay good amounts for a new sculpt of say, a Masakari (Warhawk) or a Thor (Summoner). Just my two cents. ]]> SierraStudios 2011-06-26T03:07:18-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29721&th=5627#msg_29721 Warhammer volume check. That's a 70 ton Mech in CBT scale. Lighter Mechs will be less, heavier Mechs will be more. My lightest one is 6cm^3. My second heaviest one is 13cm^3. My heaviest one is 66cm^3, and that's in the same scale. In the end, like I said, they're pushing 10cm^3. Sure, I can hollow it. At that point New FUD will be $3 less to print than Old FUD ($29 vs. $32).

As a friendly reminder, $30 would cover the cost to print. That doesn't include any profit. And while I have no delusions about getting rich, I'd at least like to make my investment back. Having been doing this for five years, I know that it's not going to happen at $1 markup per model. At this point I am much, much better off going back to resin.]]> dymihail 2011-06-26T03:46:11-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29724&th=5627#msg_29724 SierraStudios 2011-06-26T04:24:21-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29726&th=5627#msg_29726
For me, I know what my audience will pay. The Warhammers and Marauders sold out in two days, so those were under-priced at $20 apiece. Or were they? I did a second, half-run for Warhammers and they took a month to sell out. I don't like sitting on inventory for even that long. The Rifleman, OTOH, had a run about 2/3 that of the initial Warhammer run. Three months later and they're still not sold out. Similar deal for the Archers, which took about six months to sell out. All were $20 per kit. So I might be able to hit $30, but that's pushing it (though I did see one pop up on Ebay for $55 once) and it's going to leave me sitting on stock for much longer.

Now, I know what you're thinking... Maybe the kits were no good? Yes, it's patting myself on the back, but I have a darn good reputation. You're welcome to ask after me (Justicar) on Lords of the Battlefield and The Mighty Ten-12 (Star Trek 1/2500) and see what people think. I'm pretty sure you'd be amazed if you saw my Warhammer: It's 26 pieces (in two inches tall) and has fully pose-able joints. Check that Photobucket link and you'll see parts breakdowns for some of them. About the only thing I didn't do was individual missiles, and I was sorely tempted to. This is the sort of kit that FUD was meant for, but the price is just too much. Well, in resin it's a multi-part kit. In FUD I would have had a half-dozen pre-posed versions.

That's why I started looking at going from 1/300 down to 1/450. I figured with 1" tall models I could hit $10 even with mark-up. With the new pricing, it's over $10 just to print it. I'd say it's back to the drawing board, but I'll be damned if I'm going to go back and re-design a model that was within their design tolerances. There comes a point when it's just not worth the hassle, and that's pretty much where we're headed.

All that said, I won't post any real sales information here. That's not the purpose of this thread. Sorry.]]> dymihail 2011-06-26T05:10:12-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29784&th=5627#msg_29784
I had a look on SW a long time and when they announced FUD I joined the community because that was the material I was looking for. High detail and small wall thickness, the right thing for railway miniatures.

Now the pricing system looks very bad for me. I see that the handling cost for a lot of tiny things are extremely high, but this system is not attractive for shop selling miniatures. As described above no one will look at an object that will cost 6$, when it has a volume of 0.10cm³ or less.
As self consuming designers we can combine several objects in one order, but will this help reducing SW handling cost? Other byers have not this opportunity and it couldn't be the SW idea that every costumer has to contact the designer to create a specific bulk.

I would prefer a higher volume price and then a discount for more than 5cm³ or something else, as it is done with WSF. Or what do you think about a handling and shipping fee per order?

Another approach I think could be possible, would be customized sprues. It is not as handy, because I like the 3D printing approach, where you don't have to remove any sprues. But I see also the handling problem in production and shipping. So my idea is, that the designer can define one or more faces of the object, which will be used as sprues. Now a customer can add several objects to his basket and if they have the same material they will be combined to one sprue. Perhaps this can be done automatically or we need an online editor where the user can design his sprue.
This will of course reduce the optimized packing volume of the printer, but will reduce handling effort as I assume.

m2cent
Michael]]> mo-design 2011-06-27T17:17:20-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29821&th=5627#msg_29821
I know this is a tough break for a lot of you, and I'm sorry. I'm not going to weigh in on some of these details just yet, because I'm still speaking with our operations and production team, and I want any info I share to be coming from an educated place. Just know for the time being that it's not falling on deaf ears.

]]> ana 2011-06-28T05:18:53-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29931&th=5627#msg_29931

Adding two parts to cart - both parts retain the $5 fee is it is per part to be printed and not per order.

This means I will certainly have to combine lots of small parts - makes it more time consuming for me and no doubt more difficult for shapeways to manage... No doubt will also make sprues of many small parts - again time consuming my end

regards
Andy


]]> Sadwargamer 2011-06-29T22:43:28-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29957&th=5627#msg_29957
Geeze. Talk about cutting your own throat. I had been promoting Shapeways. Guess that will end.]]> eTraxx 2011-06-30T15:02:01-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29959&th=5627#msg_29959 dymihail 2011-06-30T15:06:29-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29960&th=5627#msg_29960 dymihail wrote on Thu, 30 June 2011 15:06
Put all 10 into one file. Should come out to ~$7.90 total now.


that's still more than double the price he would have payed before.]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-30T15:09:31-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29962&th=5627#msg_29962 eTraxx 2011-06-30T15:18:38-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29964&th=5627#msg_29964 SIXTHSCALE wrote on Thu, 30 June 2011 15:09

dymihail wrote on Thu, 30 June 2011 15:06

Put all 10 into one file. Should come out to ~$7.90 total now.

that's still more than double the price he would have payed before.


Yes, and it's a fraction of the $54 he'd pay under the current pricing scheme.

@eTraxx -- Instead of 50 fire hydrants, can you develop a Hero Kit? Some fire hydrants, mail boxes, park benches, chairs, light poles, etc. and gang them all together?

Yeah, not optimal. I get it. See my own previous grouses. I'm right there with you.
]]> dymihail 2011-06-30T15:36:45-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29965&th=5627#msg_29965 It's great!

Here's how I feel about FUD pricing.
The previous price was the trial period price and was announced as such. The trial is now over.

Why do Shapeways need to have a trial period for a new material?
Because they need to gauge the popularity, useage and their overall cost.

Why has Shapeways now introduced FUD with a different pricing structure?
Because, due to the popularity and useage, the overall cost to them wasn't covered in the trial period.

To put it bluntly, we as designers have to adapt to the pricing structure.

My advice to those creating lots of individual miniatures, make up different groups as one model (they may need to be sprued together). Ask your customers what groups they'd like to see (maybe offer a discount for suggestions) Advertise the models as the group pack. Price the pack reasonably... and most of all, see the mainstream pricing structure as an advantage, after all the FUD cc price has decreased.

The above is my feelings and opinion... take it or leave it

]]> stop4stuff 2011-06-30T15:37:04-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29966&th=5627#msg_29966
it's a change in role from being a drop-shipper to a small-scale manufacturer. It's also going to bring us increased costs which we are going to our customers, so we are going to have to think much more carefully about our pricing and what will sell.

But we have a wonderful new medium here, there is so much we can do that would not have been viable before, but it necessary for us and our market to mature a little and move on.


Tom ]]> tebee 2011-06-30T15:41:37-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29967&th=5627#msg_29967 ]]> eTraxx 2011-06-30T15:44:31-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29968&th=5627#msg_29968 ]]> tebee 2011-06-30T15:48:02-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29969&th=5627#msg_29969 stop4stuff wrote on Thu, 30 June 2011 15:37


The above is my feelings and opinion... take it or leave it




Yeah right, I'll leave it. Going back to WSF.

Everything is supply and demand. When the supply decided to introduce measures to cut demand, demand will drop. And eventually there is no need to supply. The huge demand during the trial period will never be. Everybody loses.

BTW, FUD is not that great. My trial pieces suffers huge breakage due to the brittle nature. I won't dare re-pack and re-ship the products to my customers. I suspect the operators in Shapeways knew that too. I think a lost of pieces break during handling and that's one of the factors of the delays. And they need to reprint my broken parts too.]]> CGD 2011-06-30T15:48:15-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29970&th=5627#msg_29970
1. Clearing the backlog by cutting demand without the need to subcontract another printer.
2. More profitability through increased price for most parts sold in this material.

Before this increase, I guess scale models enthusiasts were ordering several parts in several shops. Now, they will think twice before they order something...

I'm wondering : Any plan to push the polygon limit to 2 Million for this material ?

]]> fx 2011-06-30T16:17:36-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29971&th=5627#msg_29971
]]> stop4stuff 2011-06-30T16:47:40-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29972&th=5627#msg_29972 stop4stuff wrote on Thu, 30 June 2011 16:47
@CGD - I've had parts in both FD & FUD. FD is quite brittle and sub 1mm areas break easily, but the parts in FUD have a fair amount of flexibility at 0.3 to 0.5 mm wall thickness. There's not alot of difference between FD & FUD, except for the material density, FUD is printed at double the resoultion of FD... FUD will appear quite transparent (~90% transparency), whereas FD is noticably more opaque (~60% or less)... are you sure you received the right material?




You can take a look at my recent shipment:
http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=5621&a mp;start=0&

I ordered FUD. According to your description, I could have received 9 styles of figures in FUD and one style in FD?

That would have been very strange.

As for my previous test print of vehicles, I used the same models for WSF to print. So they were built with 0.75 to 1mm wall thickness. I got 1mm guns of FUD broken a lot. And one vehicle suffered a 3 feet (I meter) drop and shattered like glass, but that might be a FD according to your description.
]]> CGD 2011-06-30T17:05:07-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29974&th=5627#msg_29974
in fact some 1:6 scale sword blade blanks i ordered using the image popper came out paper thin because of a miscalculation of the thickness (probably my fault ) and while they are useless for the purpose i intended... they are literally flexible enough to tie them in a loose knot without them breaking. and a miniature knife i printed in FUD has blade less than a millimeter thick at the thickest part and probably .3 mm at the nonbeveled point and edge and it's not remotely brittle...

i'm still waiting on my second shipment of much more detailed FUD pieces and am really hoping that your experience is the exception to the rule and mine is not.]]> SIXTHSCALE 2011-06-30T17:34:08-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=29989&th=5627#msg_29989
Pros: Only 1 startup fee per pack
Cons:
1) Takes 3 to 10 minutes to generate pack depending how quick shapeways render engine is running
2) New model would be sold on my ICC shop so I need to keep track of sales and pay you instead of shapeways.
3) You need to trust me with your stl files.

It is an option. I can price it in 1 of 2 ways.

1) Each model has a packing percentage and customer only gets charged $5.50 per block($0.50 to cover my costs) so a model with 500,000 triangles takes up 50 spaces customer can buy up to 100.
2) Have triangle limit and minimum order and include startup in cost of each model.

If people are interested I will set it up. If people aren't fine.]]> mctrivia 2011-06-30T21:13:41-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30000&th=5627#msg_30000 dymihail 2011-06-30T22:46:48-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30001&th=5627#msg_30001 mctrivia 2011-06-30T23:00:31-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30003&th=5627#msg_30003 ]]> dymihail 2011-06-30T23:19:45-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30004&th=5627#msg_30004 ]]> eTraxx 2011-06-30T23:38:56-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30005&th=5627#msg_30005
The nice thing if one person hosts everything is people can buy products from different designers and get all grouped together.

I can pick up a dedicated domain for this service and instead of sending people to shapeways send them to www.????.com/yourshop

they see all your stuff first then get asked about others stuff afterwards. group together send to shapeways for them to order the pack.]]> mctrivia 2011-06-30T23:43:30-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30007&th=5627#msg_30007

I would like some software tool which can take a dozen strange shaped parts and pack them together so that the 10% density rule is satisfied as well as minimum clearance. I have done it by hand sometimes, but it can be tough!]]> gibell 2011-06-30T23:59:52-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30008&th=5627#msg_30008 Please hold tight,

We did not increase the price to kill demand, we have invested in new machines to handle the demand...

Nor is Shapeways trying and make the most cash possible from a popular product, we are just trying to get the balance right, as you can imagine, under $1 to print, clean and pack a delicate item is not sustainable at this point.

We are listening intently to your reactions and will do our absolute best to ensure that FD/FUD remains a viable option for your items...

Keep on letting us know what you think is a reasonable price, let us know of any quality issues you have and we will continue to try and make it happen.

Thanks again for all of your input..]]> bitstoatoms 2011-07-01T00:39:26-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30010&th=5627#msg_30010
Last time I checked, the good WD/BD/TD machine was 3x that of the good FD/FUD machine and the consumable were comparable. If that's even remotely the case, then why aren't the costs to customers comparable? I know from firsthand experience that cleaning WD parts is absolutely the pits, but there's no setup fee associated with it.

I can believe that the set-up fee is not just an attempt to pocket free money. That said, it very much is an attempt to discourage really tiny parts. Not necessarily an attempt to kill demand, just regulate demand to what can be profitable for you. Right now, that means killing tiny parts.

Broadly I don't have any issues with that. I know I wouldn't much enjoy trying to pick 5mm parts out of the tray. But my stuff is generally 25m or more (not always, but usually). You guys don't seem to have much difficulty picking them out of the WD or WSF trays...

It seems that there's not a lot of consistency. Some materials have set-up fees, others don't. Sure, some materials are more difficult to work with. Wouldn't that be better served by adjusting the volume build cost and leaving off the set-up fee?

Maybe you can have a minimum build volume requirement (but realize that we're going to gang models when that happens). How about a non-linear volume cost? Start off pretty expensive for tiny volumes, then gradually level out the cost.

No, I don't have all the answers. All I know is that it wasn't an issue to get my model in WD for 6 pennies, but now it's an issue to get that same 6 cent model in FUD and the price has ramped to $5.06.]]> dymihail 2011-07-01T01:11:32-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30011&th=5627#msg_30011
Yes, cleaning is the difficult part, and you are right that there is a lack of consistency in the pricing structure, something we are aware of and considering very closely.

The jump from 6c to $5.06 is considerable, but perhaps 6c is too little to begin with considering the cleaning, as you know is not easy at that scale.

Again thanks for your input and understanding, keep the comments coming, it all helps us work out the best way to proceed.


]]> bitstoatoms 2011-07-01T01:30:27-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30012&th=5627#msg_30012
The packing issue should be discussed with the people that handle the process. Adding sprues might be worse for the process than without if we're not careful (probability of breaks during cleaning that lodge inside the machine filters/gratings, grossly inefficient use of space/machine time, or excessive use of support material from the top of my head) So that even though it would be cheaper for users Shapeways would be shooting itself on the foot.

In the case adding sprues for multiple model printing makes sense, it would be good to design a standard way of doing it, so that it doesn't cause problems to the print shops. (One good way of saving money is not wasting it on doing things wrong)]]> cyborg_ar 2011-07-01T02:02:41-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30013&th=5627#msg_30013
Perhaps the linear approach is the problem. These machines have historically been used for prototyping. You guys have the foresight to try to use them for direct manufacturing and are several years ahead of the curve. To me, the challenge with volume-based pricing is that volume, being cubic, makes numbers get real big, real fast.

The sweet spot for what's economical for our customers is not necessarily the sweet spot for what's economical for you guys.

I have a model that's 45cc. I prototyped that (before you guys existed as a company) on an Eden in High Res (I believe you generally run them in High Speed instead). It cost a fair amount at maybe $500 or so. But when I cast that in resin, it's literally $2 worth of resin and rubber. And I could sell it for a pretty penny and make my money back quickly.

Nowadays, even after hollowing, it still costs about 50% more just to print, in a lower resolution process than my prototype, than what I sold copies of it for. So it's still not economical for me to direct manufacture this model. Convenient, sure. But only two people would buy it. When I originally set the price for it in resin, numerous people chimed in. At my original price point, the consensus was that most would buy one just to complete their collection. But by dropping the price 20%, they'd by two or more. I did, and true to their word, they did.

I know that anecdotal evidence is a poor excuse for hard data, but it's the point that's important. A lot of us know what our sweet spots need to be to keep our customers. When a model hits $10 in FUD, but costs $1 in resin or metal, and the sales point was supposed to be $8-$12, well, your direct manufacturing loses out. Sure, I could gang a bunch of them together, but that kind of defeats the purpose of you guys offering storefronts.

Cyborg's response above is interesting and deserves consideration.]]> dymihail 2011-07-01T02:08:49-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30014&th=5627#msg_30014 drscott wrote on Fri, 01 July 2011 00:39
Hey Guys,
Please hold tight,

We did not increase the price to kill demand, we have invested in new machines to handle the demand...

Nor is Shapeways trying and make the most cash possible from a popular product, we are just trying to get the balance right, as you can imagine, under $1 to print, clean and pack a delicate item is not sustainable at this point.

We are listening intently to your reactions and will do our absolute best to ensure that FD/FUD remains a viable option for your items...

Keep on letting us know what you think is a reasonable price, let us know of any quality issues you have and we will continue to try and make it happen.

Thanks again for all of your input..


Okay, I got a question, not so much about pricing, or may be it does:

Some members were talking about sprucing the loose parts in a file for FUD. But I looked into the material spec and there is no mentioning of that.

So do we need to spruce the parts or not? For tiny parts like my soldiers, the spruce might cost more than the actual items. And increasing the cost of item on the whole, not to mention the time required to spruce it.]]> CGD 2011-07-01T02:12:11-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30020&th=5627#msg_30020 here and never got a reply.

From experience the answer seems to be no, unless the parts are very small. The first time I did it got them back without the sprues and since then I've submitted several without them quite happily.

Though it would be nice to know if the make the job easier or harder for the production people - Hey guys, we we want to make things as easy as we can for you, but if you don't talk to us and give us a bit of feedback then we can't.

Tom]]> tebee 2011-07-01T06:37:48-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30026&th=5627#msg_30026
We will get back to you on whether sprues make it easier for the FUD process,

Thanks again]]> bitstoatoms 2011-07-01T07:32:13-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30032&th=5627#msg_30032
Is it a one time setup fee? For isntance I design part A and run it. I pay the setup fee plus the material cost. Next month I need part A again. Do I pay the setup fee again? or was the setup fee payed the first time I ran part A?

I am wondering if it is like whenI get photoetchings done. I pay an original tool setup cost, but when I need the parts again, the tool cost is not needed because the original tool is already ready to use.

Brian]]> 6axlepwr 2011-07-01T12:16:04-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30033&th=5627#msg_30033 6axlepwr wrote on Fri, 01 July 2011 12:16
I'm still trying to understand this setup fee and how it figures in.

Is it a one time setup fee? For isntance I design part A and run it. I pay the setup fee plus the material cost. Next month I need part A again. Do I pay the setup fee again? or was the setup fee payed the first time I ran part A?

I am wondering if it is like whenI get photoetchings done. I pay an original tool setup cost, but when I need the parts again, the tool cost is not needed because the original tool is already ready to use.

Brian


You need to pay every time you request the file to be printed.]]> CGD 2011-07-01T12:23:50-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30034&th=5627#msg_30034
]]> stop4stuff 2011-07-01T12:35:01-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30036&th=5627#msg_30036

Or more appropriately, the fee to press the "Print" button. ]]> CGD 2011-07-01T12:40:58-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30037&th=5627#msg_30037
Brian]]> 6axlepwr 2011-07-01T12:43:28-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30038&th=5627#msg_30038
Brian]]> 6axlepwr 2011-07-01T12:46:17-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30039&th=5627#msg_30039 6axlepwr wrote on Fri, 01 July 2011 12:46
Ok, then a follow up question. Say I have a tree of parts and I need 10 need copies of that tree of parts. Does this mean the setup fee is $50.00?

Brian


Yes, unless you put all 10 copies into one file, then it's still $5.]]> CGD 2011-07-01T12:49:44-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30040&th=5627#msg_30040
I can see FUD being a good source for prototypeing to see if the parts work, then get a mold cut or resin cast the part.

Thanks.

Brian]]> 6axlepwr 2011-07-01T12:57:35-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30042&th=5627#msg_30042
As long as you keep under 1,000,000 triangles you can add as much to the file as you want. If the new resulting model is more then 5.5cm^3 then you will save money with new pricing."

I did a search on Google .. found the following: http://netfabb.com/forum.php?aid=825842962&pid=213

I have netfabb basic. I played around a bit this morning trying to "Add part" to a project .. haven't had any luck yet at adding multiple parts to a file. Darn it. I might need another cup of coffee. :/

Wonder .. if you could create you files .. export as ASCII STL .. combine them as @mctrivia said using Notepad .. then load that ASCII file into netfabb or Meshlab and export as a binary STL?

Coffee before that!
]]> eTraxx 2011-07-01T13:13:48-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30043&th=5627#msg_30043 eTraxx wrote on Fri, 01 July 2011 13:13

Wonder .. if you could create you files .. export as ASCII STL .. combine them as @mctrivia said using Notepad .. then load that ASCII file into netfabb or Meshlab and export as a binary STL?

Coffee before that!




If Shapeways come back and say: You need to spruce the parts... ]]> CGD 2011-07-01T13:20:42-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30044&th=5627#msg_30044 eTraxx 2011-07-01T13:26:00-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30052&th=5627#msg_30052
Parallel Run: You can run on your server. No fancy features needed but jobs run in parallel so server load will be heavy if lots of customers come at once.

Series Run: Server load has a max because you can set how many jobs can run at once.

Offsite: The software runs on my server and you just need to install a javascript file on your web site.(this is what I will work on first as it is easiest for you)

Membership: You don't get your customers to use. You go onto my website select the files you want added and how much of each and it will make a pack for you.
]]> mctrivia 2011-07-01T15:31:26-00:00 http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=30053&th=5627#msg_30053 mctrivia wrote on Fri, 01 July 2011 15:31
My software does not yet add spruces. but I could add that feature.



I'm curious. Usually I want the spruce to connect to some unimportant area of my models, in my case, bottom of my vehicles. Or for figures, at the bottom of the shoes. I definitely don't want the spruce to connect right in the face of my figures.

How can this be automated, especially when dealing with multiple parts of different sizes and shapes, and area of importance?]]> CGD 2011-07-01T15:41:42-00:00