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interlaced but seperate objects [message #22333] Sat, 08 January 2011 21:04 UTC Go to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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I've been figuring out some chain maille designs and hit a big stumbling block.

Pieces with less than 300 interlaced, but seperate parts, e.g. this 4 in 1 sheet of 212 rings upload fine, but get up to around the 300 or above mark and the upload fails with this error message;

"error while unifying: 17

We have already tried correcting the issue using our Mesh Medic.

If you have any questions about your product, please visit www.shapeways.com/mydesign under the header "my errors" or have a look at our relevant tutorial or video.
* http://www.shapeways.com/tutorials/fixing-non-manifold-model s
* http://www.shapeways.com/video/fixing-non-manifold-meshes
"

I've narrowed the actual number to 300 in one design, but 297 fails in another... the number to trigger the error differs.

Any ideas what the issue is and/or what needs to be done to make it work?

Cheers,
Paul
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22357 is a reply to message #22333 ] Sun, 09 January 2011 14:48 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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I think I figured the answer to my own question Smile

Why Mesh Medic fails is not because of the amount of elements, but because of a relationship between the amount of elements and the total number of triangles.

What the ratio is, I've not yet figured out, but I did manage to get a chain maille model successfully uploaded with over 2000 links Smile
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22565 is a reply to message #22357 ] Thu, 13 January 2011 16:33 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Surprised

European 4 in 1 weave Chain maille dice bag - comes in at 319 elements with a total of 343296 faces (trianlges). Hopefully the upper and bottommost layers of rings will be ok as I had to reduce the number of faces by an 1/8th to get the model accepted by Mesh Medic.

Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22600 is a reply to message #22357 ] Fri, 14 January 2011 05:31 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TurtlesAreCool  is currently offline TurtlesAreCool
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stop4stuff wrote on Sun, 09 January 2011 14:48


Why Mesh Medic fails is not because of the amount of elements, but because of a relationship between the amount of elements and the total number of triangles.



Now that's *very* interesting. I am at present trying to figure out how to turn my dwarf into something that MeshMedic likes. http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=rview&goto=22 006

He has quite a few loose parts - at least 3k, and 95k faces. I'll have to see how much I have to slim him down before MeshMedic can handle it.

I'd be interested to know if you peg down more of a formula.
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22605 is a reply to message #22600 ] Fri, 14 January 2011 07:15 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Daniel, I don't think you're too far off from making your model work, this square ring chainmaille sheet has 3053 elements with a total of 97696 triangles... although there may be another issue involved too, the complexity of the interlaced objects.
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22630 is a reply to message #22605 ] Fri, 14 January 2011 15:33 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TurtlesAreCool  is currently offline TurtlesAreCool
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stop4stuff wrote on Fri, 14 January 2011 07:15

Daniel, I don't think you're too far off from making your model work, this square ring chainmaille sheet has 3053 elements with a total of 97696 triangles... although there may be another issue involved too, the complexity of the interlaced objects.


I believe your link is not publicly visible, but I understand what you're saying. I can't remember how many "shells" I have - I'll have to check netfabb again.

In any case, I used decimate to reduce *to* 25% and 35% of the original, and both worked. 50% did not. So, I'm going to try backing up a step and selectively reducing the complexity to get the poly count into that magic zone. I'll record the number of "shells" and triangles and we'll see where it goes.

Incidentally, I was not thinking and specified "faces" as reported in Blender, when I should have reported triangles after exporting to STL.
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22632 is a reply to message #22630 ] Fri, 14 January 2011 16:19 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Sorry, i made the model public now Embarassed
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #22805 is a reply to message #22632 ] Wed, 19 January 2011 10:32 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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I got the issue sorted out and chain maille works like a charm, see; It Arrived, Chain Maille Dice Bag
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #23350 is a reply to message #22805 ] Wed, 02 February 2011 11:23 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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Aaaarrrrgggghhh!!!

OK, this issue is a now 'officially' a right royal PITA!

My Large Chain Maille Dice Bag arrived today... I noticed two of the draw string chain links were fused. I re-checked my 3d model, and sure enough I hadn't centered the pivot point correctly when manouvering the links... so I corrected this and saved the model.

Next, I did my thing and uploaded the model...

Unfortunately, we were not able to process and thus print your product. The error message was:
error while unifying: 17


Uhh... wtf.... it is the exact same model with 19 parts moved x +0.191558, y +0.549985, z -0.065353 millimeters. Still the same 445 shells and still the same 261072 triangles, but the volume has changed by a whopping 0.0006 cc (due to orignally overlapping shells which I fixed)

Come on Shapeways, please resolve this number of shells vs number of triangles issue that Mesh Medic gets upset over.

Cheers



[Updated on: Wed, 02 February 2011 11:33 UTC]

Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #23372 is a reply to message #23350 ] Wed, 02 February 2011 18:21 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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The RRPITA has had some cream applied!

I uploaded the model a second time, with the 'Please fix my model manually' box ticked, and it was 'fixed' using NetFabb (the NetFabb I have showed no errors before I tried uploading)... and... hey presto... one 'fixed' and printable Large Dice Bag Smile

The moral of this saga...
If you get a unifying error 17, check the model in NetFabb and then ask for a manual fix... sorted!
Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #23529 is a reply to message #23372 ] Mon, 07 February 2011 22:50 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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mmm... issue not sorted Sad

My large chain maille dice bag works and is fine.

My Square Maille flat N coaster uploaded fine.

However, a placemat with exactly the same Square Maille flat N design but with 1842 shells failed because? (i don't really have a clue all that was shown in the failure image was a X in the shells box)... it was suggested that it may have failed because the model =2.5mm in one dimension and that i should try uploading with 2.51mm - i did this...

and...

it still failed Sad

This is not a number of shells issue...
this tester model was fine with 3053 shells - http://www.shapeways.com/model/200481/

please can someone (a Shapeways someone would be good) tell me what i need to do to make my "can't be moulded" chain maille designs work - 3d printing is where i see things imagineered bought to life... it may be i got too far outside the box, if so... someone please reel me in a bit

cheers Confused

Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #23620 is a reply to message #23529 ] Wed, 09 February 2011 16:14 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar barrys  is currently offline barrys
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Hi stop4stuff,

we'll look into this. It seems that Meshmedic can't handle them correctly when it tries to merge shells or repair the model and returns with an error, but in these cases it should not merge anything and except for the many shells there is nothing wrong with the model, so also should not repair anything.

Barry


edit:stop4stuff*, hehe sorry for that Smile

[Updated on: Wed, 09 February 2011 16:39 UTC]

Re: interlaced but seperate objects [message #23621 is a reply to message #23620 ] Wed, 09 February 2011 16:37 UTC Go to previous message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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barrys wrote on Wed, 09 February 2011 16:14

Hi shop4stuff,

we'll look into this. It seems that Meshmedic can't handle them correctly when it tries to merge shells or repair the model and returns with an error, but in these cases it should not merge anything and except for the many shells there is nothing wrong with the model, so also should not repair anything.

Barry


"shop4stuff" Laughing you saying i spend too much?
It's stop4stuff Rolling Eyes

I've received an email saying that IT & the NetFabb ppl are looking into this, so hopefully it will be sorted soon.

Cheers,
Paul

 
   
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