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Composite models [message #6468] Sat, 12 September 2009 12:16 UTC Go to next message
avatar Oskar_van_Deventer  is currently offline Oskar_van_Deventer
Messages: 414
Registered: December 2008
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Hi Shapeways,

Could you support composite models, please?

My 3D puzzles have many identical pieces. Now I have to include many identical copies in the STL, which significantly increases the triangle count. In order to stay below the 500.000 triangle limit, I have to reduce resolution. Unfortunately, even a slight reduction in the number of triangles means a significant deterioration of resolution.

My Slice Kilominx design (see below) illustrates the optimization problem.
Res: 0.02 mm --> 1.185000 triangles
Res: 0.05 mm --> 736000 triangles
Res: 0.10 mm --> 629000 triangles
Ideally, my puzzles require a 0.02 mm resolution. I had to revert to 0.15 mm resolution to make the design fit within the 500.000 triangle limit.
http://www.shapeways.com/model/49957/slice_kilominx.html
I am afraid that the design doesn't work with this poor resolution.

I could try and move the problem to my customers and scatter the pieces around my shop page. It would then be up to my customers to collect and order the right types and numbers of pieces. This is not something that my customers would appreciate, which is why I always collect composite designs in a single STL.

So can you help me solve this problem, and add the option of offering composite models, please?

Thank you!

Oskar

index.php?t=getfile&id=1325&private=0

Re: Composite models [message #6527 is a reply to message #6468 ] Mon, 14 September 2009 17:38 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TomZ  is currently offline TomZ
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Oh yes, working in pretty much the same field as you do I am also constantly struggling with the 500k limit. A way to compose different files into an assembly would be great.

By the way Oskar, I just discovered the function ReduceMesh in Rhino, which allows you to enter a number of triangles to reduce the mesh to. That way you can easily hit the 500k limit spot on.

[Updated on: Mon, 14 September 2009 18:05 UTC]

Re: Composite models [message #6528 is a reply to message #6468 ] Mon, 14 September 2009 17:52 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Youknowwho4eva  is currently offline Youknowwho4eva
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I've been thinking about, for the future, to sell my products on a separate site, have them shipped to me, I'll perform post processing, then ship them off to the final customer. Always an idea. If you can, have a supply of product on hand to ship out when ordered.


I learned a long time ago the wisest thing I can do is be on my own side, be an advocate for myself and others like me. -Maya Angelou
michael@shapeways.com Community Advocate
Re: Composite models [message #6533 is a reply to message #6468 ] Mon, 14 September 2009 20:35 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Jettuh  is currently offline Jettuh
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Youknowwho4eva,

i've been thinking about it too,
but the other side of the story is that you order some models, but you won't be really sure everything is going to be sold!
Re: Composite models [message #6704 is a reply to message #6533 ] Mon, 21 September 2009 02:12 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Whystler  is currently offline Whystler
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The problem with that is you pay twice for shipping .. once embedded into the shapeways price, and second when you ship. Not to mention that you will also have to process payments yourself.

-Whystler


Check out my website: http://tshawnjohnson.wordpress.com/
Re: Composite models [message #6733 is a reply to message #6468 ] Mon, 21 September 2009 13:20 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Youknowwho4eva  is currently offline Youknowwho4eva
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Yes, double the shipping. But you also make sure when your customer gets your product, it is as you intended it to be. And as far as having an at home inventory. That's why you wait till you know you are moving product. I would wait till I was selling 5 of something a month before I'd do that.


I learned a long time ago the wisest thing I can do is be on my own side, be an advocate for myself and others like me. -Maya Angelou
michael@shapeways.com Community Advocate
Re: Composite models [message #6801 is a reply to message #6468 ] Thu, 24 September 2009 18:09 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar randomblink  is currently offline randomblink
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Offering a means of packaging several models into one ITEM to sell would be wonderful. Having Web DB Programming in my background, I can say that it isn't that hard.

You create an item to sell that doesn't have a model attached.
Then add each model that is a part of it TO that item.
Then add your profit on top.
Voila!


Welcome to Costco, I love you.
Re: Composite models [message #7589 is a reply to message #6801 ] Tue, 03 November 2009 09:50 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TheoGeerinck  is currently offline TheoGeerinck
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I have the same problem. I use the description to communicate to potential buyers that, in order to get one complete puzzle, they need so many parts of type A and so many parts of type B. But this proves hard. I would be very sorry if people spend money on incomplete, so worthless, puzzles! I fear it happened already.
So please develop a tool to combine different parts in predefined amounts, so puzzles can only be ordered in complete packages!
Theo
Re: Composite models [message #9007 is a reply to message #6468 ] Sat, 16 January 2010 15:27 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TomZ  is currently offline TomZ
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I'm bumping this post because I would really like to see this implemented.

There is one thing that worries me: what about the $1.50 fixed cost for WSF? Putting many solid bodies into one file sort of bypasses this. If you were allowed to compose many models into one, how would the pricing work out. Most puzzles have many pieces, having to pay an extra $1.50 per piece would make it very unattractive for me. That would most likely make me ignore the feature altogether and do it the old fashioned way.

[Updated on: Sat, 16 January 2010 15:36 UTC]

Re: Composite models [message #9014 is a reply to message #9007 ] Sat, 16 January 2010 17:23 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar dadrummond  is currently offline dadrummond
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I don't think it's $1.50 per piece. It's $1.50 per print, however many pieces there might be. SW folks -- correct?


------------------
Elytra on Shapeways: http://www.shapeways.com/shops/elytra
Re: Composite models [message #9017 is a reply to message #9014 ] Sat, 16 January 2010 20:20 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TomZ  is currently offline TomZ
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Definitely not. If you order two separate WSF models you pay the $1.50 fee twice. However if the contents of the two models are combined into one model (containing two solid bodies) you only pay the fee once.
With these puzzles there are often hundreds of pieces and I'm concerned that even if an assembly function is made within Shapeways it won't be used because it will force the $1.50 fee for every part, making it too expensive compared to the time it takes to make a composite model.
Re: Composite models [message #9021 is a reply to message #6468 ] Sun, 17 January 2010 00:07 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar steryne  is currently offline steryne
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I usually offer my 3d puzzles as composite and it does reduce quality a whole lot. I have to agree with Oskar.
Re: Composite models [message #9026 is a reply to message #6468 ] Sun, 17 January 2010 03:07 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar PuzzleForge  is currently offline PuzzleForge
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I have to HEARTILY second the request for composite models. I have many puzzles that take 8 or 9 different uploads put together.

My shop is a complete cluttered mess because of this.

It would be so wonderful to have a way to group models into a composite for ordering and sales!

Please? Smile
Re: Composite models [message #9082 is a reply to message #6468 ] Tue, 19 January 2010 01:30 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Bathsheba  is currently offline Bathsheba
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Bump on this. What they said.


-Bathsheba
http://bathsheba.com
Re: Composite models [message #9195 is a reply to message #9082 ] Sun, 24 January 2010 12:33 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar pete  is currently offline pete
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HI guys,

we are working on this. Please be a little more patient!

regards,
Peter
icon14.gif  Re: Composite models [message #10039 is a reply to message #9195 ] Fri, 19 February 2010 05:37 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar PuzzleForge  is currently offline PuzzleForge
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THANK YOU! This is fantastic news. I wish there were some way I could help out. Aside from being patient, of course. Smile

Re: Composite models [message #10155 is a reply to message #6468 ] Tue, 23 February 2010 19:19 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar rawkstar320  is currently offline rawkstar320
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Registered: January 2009
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I am patiently bumping this post too.

Very Happy

Setting up models in "groups" would be pretty sweet. Especially cus I have some ideas for parts that would have something made in Sandstone, something in W Detail and/or something in WSF.

yup yup

SW Just keeps getting better doesnt it?


Aut Viam Inveniam Aut Faciam
Check out http://JakeDrews.Com and http://WondrousWidgets.Com for more designs by Jake!
Re: Composite models [message #40962 is a reply to message #9195 ] Fri, 30 December 2011 21:20 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar wwwmwww  is currently offline wwwmwww
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Registered: June 2010
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A "little" more patient means waiting 2 years? Please add this ability. Everyone that wants it PLEASE vote for it here:

Support Composite Models

Thanks,
Carl

pete wrote on Sun, 24 January 2010 12:33

HI guys,

we are working on this. Please be a little more patient!

regards,
Peter

Re: Composite models [message #43019 is a reply to message #6468 ] Sun, 29 January 2012 10:03 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar woody64  is currently offline woody64
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Registered: November 2008
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I've raised the idea to create a simple form of item coupling.

I've learned from my discussions that:
- it's important for shapeways to have a connected set of items
(that reduces the handling costs)

Therefore we discussed also sprues very intensively.

My idea is to have an item connected to a sprue with an anchor on one side.
Thus placing two items on the left or right anchor position would make it easy to connect (when placed in the printing area but could also be done automatically)

Here's a picture how that may look like.
index.php?t=getfile&id=14014&private=0

This feature could be set during upload. Afterwards shapeway's can enable:
- storing the anchor position for internal usage
- reduce the handling costs for items using this feature

Woody64

[Updated on: Sun, 29 January 2012 10:04 UTC]


More then 8100 items sold over SW (but still a hobby)
Minifigcustomsin3d at: Facebook Flickr Twitter
References: 3d Printing Industries, CNN, J. Burks, Ugly Duckling, M.Evans, Stop Motion Film,Computer BILD, How to Become a 3D Printing Entrepreneur
More then 270 shop items (more then 146 already printed once) More the 500 successful Products (Items&material printed once)
Re: Composite models [message #43041 is a reply to message #43019 ] Sun, 29 January 2012 16:17 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar mo-design  is currently offline mo-design
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Hi Woody,

looks like a interesting idea. Would be glad, if the can realize something similar.

Greetings
Michael
Re: Composite models [message #47686 is a reply to message #43041 ] Mon, 30 April 2012 19:39 UTC Go to previous message
avatar woody64  is currently offline woody64
Messages: 474
Registered: November 2008
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I want to address once more my composite model proposal listed above.

I know that's also on the feature list but this proposal would be much easier to implement in the first step.

Any comments from shapeways.

Any other shop owner comments if that would also be helpful for them.

Woody64


More then 8100 items sold over SW (but still a hobby)
Minifigcustomsin3d at: Facebook Flickr Twitter
References: 3d Printing Industries, CNN, J. Burks, Ugly Duckling, M.Evans, Stop Motion Film,Computer BILD, How to Become a 3D Printing Entrepreneur
More then 270 shop items (more then 146 already printed once) More the 500 successful Products (Items&material printed once)

 
   
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