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Why are my parts expensive [message #75854] Tue, 01 October 2013 02:08 UTC Go to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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I was wondering why every single part i design and upload is expensive even though the parts are small and are thin.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75858 is a reply to message #75854 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 02:42 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TrainThingz  is currently offline TrainThingz
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Those parts don't look particularly small to me...

Most of the cost of a Shapeways-made item is in the material used. Go to your item's "Edit Item" page - the VOLUME of your item will be there in CCs (cubic centimeters) . That's what you need to minimize to make it less expensive.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75859 is a reply to message #75858 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 03:01 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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The biggest piece is 2.5 inches tall and a maximum of an 1/8 inch thick but even with the cheapest material makes the piece, , expensive. I've seen bigger parts on shapeways that are cheaper. It seems like the box that my piece would fit in is being used to calculate the volume.

[Updated on: Tue, 01 October 2013 03:04 UTC]

Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75860 is a reply to message #75859 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 03:05 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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Why's my link not appearing? here it is again https://www.shapeways.com/model/1372396/spor-t-motor-mount.h tml?li=my-models&materialId=6
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75872 is a reply to message #75860 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 09:16 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar mkroeker is currently online mkroeker
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You could easily calculate the cost of the bounding box of your part - all solid it would be around 400$ (you are basically building a brick by sticking tiny grains of sand together, so this is not going to be particularly cheap or efficient).

Other motor mounts (such as the "Guan'Li Icon A5 Motor Mount" as listed in the "related items" when one pulls up the model page of your part) do not appear to be much different in price - as it is volume that counts, changes in the dimensions tend to affect the price cubed. BTW what is the calculated density of your part (as listed on the "Edit Model" page) ? My rough calculation from bounding box and listed price is around 6%, and if it happens to be below 10% your model will not benefit from the 50% discount applied after the first 20ccm - though it would be a difference of a few dollars in your case).
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75877 is a reply to message #75872 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 12:27 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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Density is 9.26% lol almost there. Is there any other way i could get these parts https://www.shapeways.com/model/1372376/spor-t-parts.html?li =my-models&materialId=6 made for less? I need one set for a prototype before i send the full design to an R/C aircraft manufacturer. Why i was thinking that a box from around my model was being measured is because i had uploaded a different model that was much larger but cost nearly the same as the one in the link.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75879 is a reply to message #75877 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 13:01 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar mkroeker is currently online mkroeker
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You could try stuffing the "wing support tip" in there instead of printing it separately (provided there is enough clearance).
Apart from that, the only way to reduce cost would be to save on material - make the plates thinner or cut holes in them if/where material is not needed for structural strength, especially in the big square plates of the "Spor-T Parts" bundle.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75913 is a reply to message #75879 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 20:11 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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The wing suport tips are in there and the plates are a 1/16 or less already so i guess i'll just have to find some other way to get the parts made
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75915 is a reply to message #75913 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 20:39 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TrainThingz  is currently offline TrainThingz
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I'm made to think of a sign my Dad had up in his office at work... He was an aeronautical engineer (Before they started calling it "aerospace")

Quote:

Acme Aircraft

We make airplanes Fast, Good, and Cheap.





Pick any two

[Updated on: Tue, 01 October 2013 20:43 UTC]

Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75917 is a reply to message #75913 ] Tue, 01 October 2013 20:43 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar mkroeker is currently online mkroeker
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Depending on where you are, you could perhaps try to find a "makerspace"/"hackerspace"/"fab lab" (community-run shared machine shop) in your neighborhood that offers access to a 3d printer (though it will probably be one of the cheaper and more simple fdm machines, think glue gun on steroids).
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75934 is a reply to message #75915 ] Wed, 02 October 2013 06:02 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar AmLachDesigns  is currently offline AmLachDesigns
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Quote:



We make airplanes Fast, Good, and Cheap.



Pick any two


True in many spheres. However, the ACME Company's grammar left much to be desired...
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75997 is a reply to message #75934 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 02:47 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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What i'm really confused about now is why my full set of parts is has a volume of about 4cc (checked it with one of the tools on autodesk inventor) which cost about $12 in plastic plus $2.50 for handling, but when i want to buy it, it says that it'll cost me $83.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #75998 is a reply to message #75915 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 02:53 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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TrainThingz wrote on Tue, 01 October 2013 20:39


Quote:

Acme Aircraft

We make airplanes Fast, Good, and Cheap.





Pick any two



True but 3d printing is not fast nor cheap and an injection mold would do a much better job.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76000 is a reply to message #75998 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 03:17 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TrainThingz  is currently offline TrainThingz
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Have you priced injection molding????

You could buy a top end 3d printer for what the molds alone would cost you to have made.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76002 is a reply to message #75997 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 05:23 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar AmLachDesigns  is currently offline AmLachDesigns
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Quote:

What i'm really confused about now is why my full set of parts is has a volume of about 4cc (checked it with one of the tools on autodesk inventor) which cost about $12 in plastic plus $2.50 for handling, but when i want to buy it, it says that it'll cost me $83.


What does SW say the volume is? The information is available from the Edit Model view. The implication is that your model is not quite right and that Shapeways is 'fixing' it on upload - closing holes etc. This can have the effect of adding volume.

If the volume on SW is higher, then check your model for holes in the mesh, non-manifold mesh and inverted normals.

Edit: Also note that for a model to be hollow in printing terms (as opposed to theoretically) there must be one more more escape holes for the support material. If a hollow is totally enclosed the model will be treated as solid.

[Updated on: Thu, 03 October 2013 05:26 UTC]

Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76014 is a reply to message #75997 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 13:38 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar mkroeker is currently online mkroeker
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Check the scale - maybe something went wrong there, and the parts are either bigger than you need them, or you miscalculated the
volume in inventor. The two 7x7cm end plates in the "spor-t" set alone would cost around 14$ each if they are 2mm thick (and that is
ignoring the protruding tube segment), and if you add to that the price of two of the wingtip support things and the motor mount you end
up not far from what shapeways shows for the kit.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76038 is a reply to message #76002 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 20:03 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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AmLachDesigns wrote on Thu, 03 October 2013 05:23

Quote:

What i'm really confused about now is why my full set of parts is has a volume of about 4cc (checked it with one of the tools on autodesk inventor) which cost about $12 in plastic plus $2.50 for handling, but when i want to buy it, it says that it'll cost me $83.


What does SW say the volume is? The information is available from the Edit Model view. The implication is that your model is not quite right and that Shapeways is 'fixing' it on upload - closing holes etc. This can have the effect of adding volume.

If the volume on SW is higher, then check your model for holes in the mesh, non-manifold mesh and inverted normals.

Edit: Also note that for a model to be hollow in printing terms (as opposed to theoretically) there must be one more more escape holes for the support material. If a hollow is totally enclosed the model will be treated as solid.


It says that the volume is 58.2913cm3. I want my model to be solid which i think i have it designed as.

"If the volume on SW is higher, then check your model for holes in the mesh, non-manifold mesh and inverted normals. "
How do i know if i have those? In autodesk inventor it looks fine.

Once before i had a problem similar to this one in which shapeways said it would cost $300 to print and when i changed it to be availible for sale (i think), it dropped down to $7. that's not working this time though
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76039 is a reply to message #76000 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 20:05 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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TrainThingz wrote on Thu, 03 October 2013 03:17

Have you priced injection molding????

You could buy a top end 3d printer for what the molds alone would cost you to have made.

Injection molding is cheaper and faster for the quantity of parts i need. 3d printing 1 set will work for testing the design.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76041 is a reply to message #76014 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 20:11 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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mkroeker wrote on Thu, 03 October 2013 13:38

Check the scale - maybe something went wrong there, and the parts are either bigger than you need them, or you miscalculated the
volume in inventor. The two 7x7cm end plates in the "spor-t" set alone would cost around 14$ each if they are 2mm thick (and that is
ignoring the protruding tube segment), and if you add to that the price of two of the wingtip support things and the motor mount you end
up not far from what shapeways shows for the kit.

My bad, i said the wrong thickness; the plates are 1/32 (.79 mm) thick with .08" (2mm) spikes
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76043 is a reply to message #76041 ] Thu, 03 October 2013 20:26 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar mkroeker is currently online mkroeker
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They do look thicker in the preview - assuming the motor mount part in the kit is the same as your first model, 1 centimeter would be about 1/8th of its length, and the plates appear closer to 1/5th of that than to below 1/10th.
Is the overall size of your model as reported by shapeways close to your expected value ? You might want to get a copy of the freeware netfabb studio basic from netfabb.com to check size and thickness of your parts - in particular as Inventor appears to have the nasty habit of exporting in centimeters by default.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76055 is a reply to message #76043 ] Fri, 04 October 2013 00:03 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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mkroeker wrote on Thu, 03 October 2013 20:26

in particular as Inventor appears to have the nasty habit of exporting in centimeters by default.

i bet that's the problem. i keep checking off inches as the units when i upload the model because that's what i designed it in but the units being off definitely would be causing this issue.
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76057 is a reply to message #76043 ] Fri, 04 October 2013 00:18 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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mkroeker wrote on Thu, 03 October 2013 20:26

They do look thicker in the preview - assuming the motor mount part in the kit is the same as your first model, 1 centimeter would be about 1/8th of its length, and the plates appear closer to 1/5th of that than to below 1/10th.
Is the overall size of your model as reported by shapeways close to your expected value ? You might want to get a copy of the freeware netfabb studio basic from netfabb.com to check size and thickness of your parts - in particular as Inventor appears to have the nasty habit of exporting in centimeters by default.

the motor mount is the same in both places. the size shape way's says for the set of parts is 2.532 w x 4.938 d x 2.94 h but it shouldn't be much over 1x1x2. i can't figure out how to change the export units
Re: Why are my parts expensive [message #76060 is a reply to message #76057 ] Fri, 04 October 2013 00:39 UTC Go to previous message
avatar builder_bob  is currently offline builder_bob
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I got it now! $6 a print! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

 
   
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