Introducing 14k Gold, read more on the blog.
Home » Support » 3D Printing » Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed
Search Search  
Show: Today's Messages    Show Polls    Message Navigator
Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43478] Sun, 05 February 2012 10:33 UTC Go to next message
avatar Kaczor  is currently offline Kaczor
Messages: 35
Registered: December 2011
Go to my shop
Member
My pallet set was bought by two customers. First time it was printed and and shipped, second time it was rejected ("walls too thin"). What does it depend?
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43483 is a reply to message #43478 ] Sun, 05 February 2012 14:32 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stonysmith  is currently offline stonysmith
Messages: 1693
Registered: August 2008
Go to my shop
Senior Member
moderator
First, I encourage you to add some votes to this suggestion:
http://feedback.shapeways.com/forums/111989-shapeways-feedba ck/suggestions/2396166-model-has-been-printed-flag

If your model is made up of multiple shells, it may well have a spot that appears too thin because of the issue raised here:
http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=msg&goto=4196 9&&srch=meshmedic#msg_41969

Part of the trouble is that every time a model is ordered, it is re-checked by a human for thin walls against the (current) design rules, and the specific points they check around the model are random. One operator may catch a thin wall that was missed by another operator.

I've had many, many models that were within the design rules, but I would later get a message from production: "Can you fatten up this section? It keeps failing while we're trying to print it, or breaking while we're trying to clean it." Every failed attempt means loss of time and materials for the production department, and I've been very glad to re-design stuff so as to make the model(s) more printable.

I have also had success in sending a message to service@shapeways.com and requesting a review of the thin walls rejection: sometimes I DO need to refine my design, sometimes they agree that it should have not have been rejected. This give-and-take process is MUCH more agreeable since they got rid of the $25 minimum purchase.

[Updated on: Sun, 05 February 2012 14:38 UTC]


Patience, Persistance, Politeness - the 3Ps will help us get us to Perfect Printed Products
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43487 is a reply to message #43483 ] Sun, 05 February 2012 15:00 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Kaczor  is currently offline Kaczor
Messages: 35
Registered: December 2011
Go to my shop
Member
This is big issue because it could discourage customers to my shop. They could say "he makes unprintable, bad designed models so I don't buy anything here anymore".
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43492 is a reply to message #43487 ] Sun, 05 February 2012 16:29 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Roy_Stevens  is currently offline Roy_Stevens
Messages: 141
Registered: November 2009
Go to my shop
Senior Member
I completely agree, and have had the same problems recently with my FUD models. My opinion is that your model got oriented badly, in a machine that was getting a bit out of calibration. When that happens walls that are at or near the minimum thickness will fail, and if the machine operator is in a bad mood he/she will will mark your model as being a bad file rather than blaming it on the operator, orientation, or machine calibration. And good luck getting help from Shapeways service. I had a model printed succesfully 128 times, and then this happened to me and all the existing orders for it were summarily cancelled, costing me several hundred dollars directly and quite a bit more in bad PR.


Earl Grey, hot.
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43567 is a reply to message #43478 ] Mon, 06 February 2012 20:01 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Youknowwho4eva  is currently offline Youknowwho4eva
Messages: 5115
Registered: September 2008
Go to my shop
Senior Member
I work here
Kaczor, looking at the standard shapeways render, it looks like you have some sort of mesh issue with some of your pallets. I can see the bottom post has a black area, which usually indicates either inverted normals, or overlapping mesh. index.php?t=getfile&id=14350&private=0

  • Attachment: pallets.jpg
    (Size: 95.89KB, Downloaded 216 time(s))


The Mad Moder
michael@shapeways.com
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43570 is a reply to message #43492 ] Mon, 06 February 2012 20:13 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar ana  is currently offline ana
Messages: 765
Registered: October 2008
Go to my shop
Senior Member
I work here
@Kaczor unfortunately 3D printing is not yet a fully understood, 100% reliable form of manufacturing. My team and people like you in our community are actually pioneering the process, which can admittedly be a difficult experience, as well as an exciting one.

With regard to your customers, know that we want very much for your relationship with them to be as strong as possible. When shopowners win, Shapeways wins too. We're looking into a number things both on the software side, and on the Supply Chain side to ensure that you deal with this very infrequently. And please do vote in Uservoice, like Stony said!

@johnny while I empathize with your frustration there, we ask that you keep you criticism constructive. In the future, if you have problems which aren't being addressed via normal interactions with CS, I ask that you let me know so that I can help coordinate between you and the support team. Thanks in advance.


Community Manager | Shapeways

Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43572 is a reply to message #43570 ] Mon, 06 February 2012 20:32 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Kaczor  is currently offline Kaczor
Messages: 35
Registered: December 2011
Go to my shop
Member
@Youknowwho4eva - I think it's a render glitch. I checked it in netfabb - 10 shells, no errors...

PS. Another guy have bought it so now I'm waiting for verification result.
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43573 is a reply to message #43572 ] Mon, 06 February 2012 20:35 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stonysmith  is currently offline stonysmith
Messages: 1693
Registered: August 2008
Go to my shop
Senior Member
moderator
One option is to send the file via PM to me and I'll take a look.


Patience, Persistance, Politeness - the 3Ps will help us get us to Perfect Printed Products
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43633 is a reply to message #43573 ] Tue, 07 February 2012 18:41 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Kaczor  is currently offline Kaczor
Messages: 35
Registered: December 2011
Go to my shop
Member
False alarm. It was my fault Embarassed

Probably because Sketchup rounded up dimensions to 0,3mm...
index.php?t=getfile&id=14389&private=0

  • Attachment: 252091-1.jpg
    (Size: 70.60KB, Downloaded 156 time(s))

[Updated on: Tue, 07 February 2012 18:43 UTC]

Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43634 is a reply to message #43633 ] Tue, 07 February 2012 18:48 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stonysmith  is currently offline stonysmith
Messages: 1693
Registered: August 2008
Go to my shop
Senior Member
moderator
Quote: "It's always something."

Glad you found it.


Patience, Persistance, Politeness - the 3Ps will help us get us to Perfect Printed Products
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43636 is a reply to message #43478 ] Tue, 07 February 2012 19:02 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Kasss_Gnarl  is currently offline Kasss_Gnarl
Messages: 29
Registered: July 2011
Go to all my models
Junior Member
Hi Kaczor,

When using Sketchup (version 8, not sure if it is the same on earlier versions) you can alter the amount of decimal places displayed to help prevent problems like this. All you need to do is go to 'window' -> 'Model Info'-> On the list that pops up select 'Units' then you can set the percision of Length units and Angles. As far as I can tell you have to set this on a model by model basis.
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43639 is a reply to message #43636 ] Tue, 07 February 2012 20:01 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Kaczor  is currently offline Kaczor
Messages: 35
Registered: December 2011
Go to my shop
Member
@Kasss_Gnarl - thank you! Very useful information Razz
Re: Same model sometimes rejected sometimes printed [message #43652 is a reply to message #43570 ] Wed, 08 February 2012 01:50 UTC Go to previous message
avatar Roy_Stevens  is currently offline Roy_Stevens
Messages: 141
Registered: November 2009
Go to my shop
Senior Member
I model in Solidworks for a living and always add a couple thou above min wall thickness, yet still have reoccuring problems with rejected models. I believe that letting the community know that such things occur can be constructive. I don't know for certain why it happens, but I labeled conjectures as my opinion.


Earl Grey, hot.

 
   
Previous Topic:Ceramic Glaze on Part Bottom
Next Topic:wall thickness big head - Sandstone