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Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #42939] Fri, 27 January 2012 23:11 UTC Go to next message
avatar lensman  is currently offline lensman
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I saw a ring printed here recently in stainless steel. The band was just barely 1mm thick. Now in the design rules for s/steel the minimum thickness is supposed to be 3mm. Certainly for flat pendants that is the case.

How is it then, that this ring was able to be printed?

Glenn


Glenn ------ My Website Third Dimension Jewellery
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #42949 is a reply to message #42939 ] Sat, 28 January 2012 02:40 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar TurtlesAreCool  is currently offline TurtlesAreCool
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"They're more like guidelines."

Seriously, though, have you seen the "advanced" design rules?

Standard SS design rules: http://www.shapeways.com/design-rules/stainless-steel
Advanced rules (from bottom of the normal rules page): http://www.shapeways.com/design-rules/stainless-steel-under- 3-mm

Now, I've not printed a ton of stainless steel stuff (and we'll see how my latest batch comes out on Tuesday), but there seems to be some room for breaking the 3mm rule on small things. One of the bigger keys seems to be the ability to be picked up and to support itself while the infusing box is filled with the support material.

1mm for a ring does seem to be pushing the limits of the process rather severely, though.
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #42950 is a reply to message #42939 ] Sat, 28 January 2012 03:04 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar lensman  is currently offline lensman
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Yep, well you can see it here...

http://www.shapeways.com/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=7910&a mp;start=0&


Glenn ------ My Website Third Dimension Jewellery
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #42961 is a reply to message #42950 ] Sat, 28 January 2012 10:55 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar stop4stuff  is currently offline stop4stuff
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It's probably beacuse that ring has simple geometry, my Twin Rail Mobius Pendant has maximum 2mm wall thicknesses and it is much bigger (46mm max diameter) - My dice shown as examples on the advanced rules page have 1 to 1.2mm walls, with the stepping having 0.2mm overlaps.

Some designs work easily in steel, others don't.
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50473 is a reply to message #42949 ] Wed, 27 June 2012 21:12 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Tamfang  is currently offline Tamfang
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I have here Bathsheba Grossman's Mini Gyroid, which I bought about five years ago. The edges are 1mm at most; the interior looks thinner (even without the holes), with details about 1/3 mm.

Is Shapeways' metal process radically different?
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50477 is a reply to message #42939 ] Wed, 27 June 2012 21:49 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar lensman  is currently offline lensman
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Radically different from what? From Bathsheba's process? I believe she prints most, if not all, of her objects through Shapeways. If you mean different now as opposed to years ago, then, yes, they will print far less "risky" objects now. Items they might have printed they now will not - such as moving metal parts; I have a Harry Potter pendant with a movable bail that was printed in s/steel but soon after they said I could not print that again.

Glenn


Glenn ------ My Website Third Dimension Jewellery
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50483 is a reply to message #50477 ] Thu, 28 June 2012 01:38 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Tamfang  is currently offline Tamfang
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So if I were to buy a "Mini Gyroid" now, it would be three times as thick as my old one?
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50484 is a reply to message #42939 ] Thu, 28 June 2012 03:04 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar lensman  is currently offline lensman
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No, I don't believe so. In looking at the model and the design rules from what I can see the thin areas are supported by thicker ones.

Easiest way to check would be to go to the model here and check the size spec's against your old one. And if it's not available in s/steel then perhaps it is because it cannot be printed.

Glenn


Glenn ------ My Website Third Dimension Jewellery
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50485 is a reply to message #50484 ] Thu, 28 June 2012 03:25 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Tamfang  is currently offline Tamfang
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Curious: mine is 3.6 cm, and that size is still offered on her site; but the one offered here is 5 cm. The proportions look the same.
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50486 is a reply to message #42939 ] Thu, 28 June 2012 03:29 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar lensman  is currently offline lensman
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Best to contact her directly; I'm sure she can answer all your questions.

Glenn


Glenn ------ My Website Third Dimension Jewellery
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50487 is a reply to message #50477 ] Thu, 28 June 2012 05:07 UTC Go to previous messageGo to next message
avatar Bathsheba  is currently offline Bathsheba
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lensman wrote on Wed, 27 June 2012 21:49

Radically different from what? From Bathsheba's process? I believe she prints most, if not all, of her objects through Shapeways.



Not entirely. I sell metal prints both on Shapeways and at bathsheba.com, but those at bathsheba.com, I order directly from Ex One rather than through Shapeways. It's exactly the same process that you get from Shapeways, since it's the same supplier, but since my relationship with Ex One predates the existence of Shapeways, it makes sense for me to continue doing business with them directly.

Quote:


If you mean different now as opposed to years ago, then, yes, they will print far less "risky" objects now. Items they might have printed they now will not - such as moving metal parts; I have a Harry Potter pendant with a movable bail that was printed in s/steel but soon after they said I could not print that again.



I do agree that Shapeways' guidelines seem very conservative at this time, relative to what this process can actually do. As you say that used to be less true, and I bet that pendulum will start to swing back again eventually.

Loose parts actually are difficult for Ex One -- unless and until they figure something out, I'd bet on that one staying in place.

Overall it's a tough problem, and I bet it'll never quite go away. I still sometimes get parts sent back because they won't print.


-Bathsheba
http://bathsheba.com
Re: Just what are the design rules for stainless steel? [message #50552 is a reply to message #50487 ] Thu, 28 June 2012 19:52 UTC Go to previous message
avatar nancyliang  is currently offline nancyliang
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Hey guys,

With the variety of geometries we have, we do set the minimum conservatively so that the bulk of the models will be printed at those minimums. But, this is why we have the "advanced" rules.. which isn't so much technically advanced just more details for printing thinner structures.

We are working to get more automated checks in place, and maybe one day you won't even have to worry about nuanced design rules as our computers can just give you feedback on a case by case basis.

We can talk to our production partners and see if we can fine tune our rules even more and how to give thinner structures. I think little details like small handlebars (both sides supported) on model trains might be doable at thinner walls.

Nancy



Product Manager
Twitter: @nliang

 
   
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