| Metal Casting [message #8196] Thu, 10 December 2009 12:27 UTC |
 |
|
I 've been looking recently for a technique to transfer my Shapeways 3D prints in metal without printing directly in stainless steel, but instead, using metal casting. Printing directly in stainless steel goes very expensive and it is very difficult to take advantage of the final product.
So, I followed this forum post regarding new Shapeways materials. Wax was my suggestion in order to give the printed wax model to a foundry for metal process.
I also saw another forum post by Zorink, who used the White Strong and Flexible material instead of wax.
Similar to Zorink, I have a Dutch sculptor friend, Barbara Perquin, who uses a special metal casting technique to produce her sculptures. Here is what she does: She usually takes a real branch of a tree and gives it to a foundry. The foundry behaves to that branch as it would be wax and melts metal on it. As a result, the branch burns and is replaced by the metal.
I think this is a technique that worths a further exploration. What I mean is, that we can explore any special requirements for this kind of metal casting, like wall thickness etc.
http://shpws.me/DWg
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8269 is a reply to message #8196 ] Sat, 12 December 2009 16:27 UTC |
 |
|
Hi guys,
we will look into wax printing.
Can we start a poll here, how many of you are interested?
What would max dimensions need to be (smaller is less expensive).
best regards,
Peter
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8285 is a reply to message #8269 ] Sat, 12 December 2009 19:48 UTC |
|
|
I'm interested...for jewelry I could live with 8cm
sculpture is another story
let's start with jewelry...
|
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8312 is a reply to message #8303 ] Mon, 14 December 2009 01:24 UTC |
|
|
Forgive my ignorance on the subject, but couldn't you make a mold of your WSF piece in order to make a Wax master?
Obviously it would only work for shapes that don't have undercuts etc, but there's no reason you couldn't mold these pieces separately and join them together before the actual casting.
This would ensure your burn out happens perfectly for the casting stage.
Again, I have little knowledge in the area, any feedback would be appreciated - I've long wanted to try this.
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8317 is a reply to message #8312 ] Mon, 14 December 2009 13:17 UTC |
|
|
I use a rubber for molds and vulcanize temperature is about 300 deg F. The only material that can take this temperature right now is stainless.
A silicone mold could be made with any of the plastics and I have considered this as an option.
You can get away with small undercuts as the mold is flexable.
Wax gives the designer the option of hollow cast objects, which is not so simple with rubber molds.
[Updated on: Mon, 14 December 2009 13:18 UTC]
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8330 is a reply to message #8312 ] Tue, 15 December 2009 02:42 UTC |
|
|
|
The brand behind WSF, EOS, has a PolyStyrene material for this. I found some slides explaining how it works look for PrimeCast, page 16 and next. This material could work for "toys" too (I think some miniatures/toys are just that, PS), and then just require a similar finishing like in the PDF, but with glue or putty instead of wax, to get a smooth surface. Probably the wax trick could also be useful with WSF, by the way.
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8359 is a reply to message #8196 ] Wed, 16 December 2009 23:16 UTC |
|
|
|
i'm interested in wax for investment casting, I wouldn't need anything much larger than 100Lx80Wx80H mm for what I do, but i can see the model engineer/live steam guys being very interested in this, and they require parts a bit bigger, maybe 200x200x150mm.
|
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8362 is a reply to message #8360 ] Thu, 17 December 2009 00:51 UTC |
|
|
Mark, it is nice to see other model train stuff. I saw your Shay stack and a refference to the Mapleton Shay. I just got my first wheel center for the 7/8" scale Mapleton Shay project I am working on and a bunch more stuff will get to me tomorrow.
I checked on silicone rubber vulcanizing temperature and they make a low temperature silicone for printed patterns see: http://www.castaldo.com/english/usinprod/objet_vlt_article/o bjet_vlt_article.html
Wax will still be very handy as I am a small scale live steamer and steam engine cylinders need internal passages and a smooth bore. As Shapeways will make every wax pattern for metal casters that want hollow objects or fine detail, I hope that it makes sense. It will give model engineers a real chance to make very accurate scale versions of the real thing.
Dan
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8370 is a reply to message #8269 ] Thu, 17 December 2009 14:00 UTC |
|
|
I'm very interested in this as it'd open up a LOT of possibilities for me.
Like everyone else (I think) I could live with 100mm x 80mm x 80mm very well.
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8371 is a reply to message #8269 ] Thu, 17 December 2009 17:15 UTC |
|
|
| pete wrote on Sat, 12 December 2009 16:27 |
Hi guys,
we will look into wax printing.
Can we start a poll here, how many of you are interested?
|
I've got lots of things I'd like cast from waxes....
| Quote: |
What would max dimensions need to be (smaller is less expensive).
|
At least 160 mm long, minimum wall, less than 1mm.
But please not a Solidscape machine. They produce very good waxes but are slow and therefore expensive.
Bill Bedford
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8422 is a reply to message #8371 ] Sat, 19 December 2009 16:08 UTC |
|
|
Okay looks like quite a few have interest in Wax printing. We will keep you posted....
Peter
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8512 is a reply to message #8422 ] Wed, 23 December 2009 13:21 UTC |
|
|
I believe there are LOTS of people interested in wax printing.
Do not decide by this forum post and only...
If you make a poll on the front page, or somewhere else on the site, more visible to visitors, you will get better results on this I think...
http://shpws.me/DWg
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8987 is a reply to message #8269 ] Fri, 15 January 2010 13:29 UTC |
|
|
| pete wrote on Sat, 12 December 2009 16:27 |
Hi guys,
we will look into wax printing.
Can we start a poll here, how many of you are interested?
What would max dimensions need to be (smaller is less expensive).
best regards,
Peter
|
I am definitely interested.
For most of my items dimensions could be under 3cm x 3cm x 3cm and I would be thrilled.
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #8994 is a reply to message #8987 ] Fri, 15 January 2010 19:06 UTC |
|
|
|
Bigger is better for me, but I would LOVE to be able to buy wax prints!
|
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #20313 is a reply to message #8269 ] Wed, 10 November 2010 12:49 UTC |
|
|
I'd love wax to be available as a material for jewellery. Size-wise up to 5 or 6 cm would probably suffice.
unellenu.com
|
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #23339 is a reply to message #21578 ] Wed, 02 February 2011 04:18 UTC |
|
|
|
Also super interested in wax for jewellery!! Any word on this???
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #35374 is a reply to message #24357 ] Thu, 29 September 2011 01:49 UTC |
|
|
Has there been any update on this?
I had a bad experience with trying to cast FUD...the caster told me that instead of melting away it actually expands just before burnout, this causes the investment plaster to crack and flake, and the resulting cast is terrible.
He said he had printed WSF with no problem, however, as a jeweller, I would really like to go for something that has the highest resolution possible so yes, high res wax is a MUST for jewellers. Im amazed there hasn't been more call for this.
On a positive note, an alternative would be to print directly into sterling, I was VERY pleased with the one I did, .3mm detail was precise and clear...so why not just make a vulcanised rubber mold from the SS print? Sure it costs more that other shapeways materials, but when you think about it you are cutting out the middle man...and would probably pay close to the same if not more to have the wax made into SS at a casting house...
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #35382 is a reply to message #35374 ] Thu, 29 September 2011 09:00 UTC |
|
|
Why not make a RTV mould from your FUD model?
Bill Bedford
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #35563 is a reply to message #35382 ] Sat, 01 October 2011 00:57 UTC |
|
|
|
Ill look into it Bill...not that familiar with the mold making process but was led to believe that the model needed to withstand the heat and pressure used in the process, also the surface material may play a part, I went to get a small bronze model molded but needed to have it gold plated before I could, as it would have stuck to the rubber or something.
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #35566 is a reply to message #8196 ] Sat, 01 October 2011 02:10 UTC |
|
|
Hi,
I believe there is a cold mold process that should work for models in almost any material (this removes the problem of heat and pressure).
I haven't yet tried this process with any of my Shapeways models ( I have the intention but haven't yet made time for this)but I have in the past had cold molds made (by jewelry casting companies here in Australia) from some relatively fragile hand-sculpted, polymer clay, jewelry sized pieces .
Hope this helps.
Janelle.
unellenu.com
|
|
|
| Re: Metal Casting [message #39024 is a reply to message #8196 ] Tue, 22 November 2011 02:26 UTC |
|
|
http://www.smooth-on.com
I read something on the forums here that FUD doesn't play well with silicone rubbers, though. I'll have to look into that as that's what I'm hoping to do with some of my prints.
Is there something that FUD can be coated with that will allow it to be used with silicone rubber without losing much detail?
|
|
|
Search
