POLL: Should Shapeways Consider Offering Electroplating Services For Plastics?

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Feedback' started by Bobbiethejean, Nov 8, 2013.

  1. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    A few days ago I asked if Shapeways would ever consider offering electroplating services for plastics and one of the moderators replied thusly: "Electroplating requests: YES! Please make your voice heard so that the community team can prove there's demand for other materials and finishes. Without that, it's very hard for us to champion them."

    So basically what I gleaned from that is something like yes, we will in the very least try it and see how it works out but ONLY if enough people want it and speak out in favor of it. The question then becomes, my fellow Makers, do you want it? Here is my argument in favor of Shapeways offering electroplating services:

    1.) It CAN be done! You might be thinking "you can't electroplate plastic! It's not conductive!" No it's not but you can make it conductive with sprays or rinses. If it can hold a conductive coating, it can be electroplated.

    2.) Convenience, speed, trust, rapport. I like the idea of being able to have a nice, shiny, plated model straight from Shapeways rather than having to send my model off somewhere else to be electroplated. That would take a lot longer for one thing and I also don't like the idea of shipping my model off somewhere else because they might break it or lose it. I know and trust Shapeways. I feel far more comfortable with them handling my models than some other entity I've not established a rapport with.

    3.) Pricing. I can't speak for anyone else here but I have come up with several designs that are, at present, not printable in any of the metals either because the designs are too big, too elaborate, or printing them in metal would be prohibitively expensive. Printing something up in FDP then having it plated would give it that nice metallic look without breaking the bank. I'm aware that plating would add to the price but there's no way plating a 40$ key will come anywhere NEAR the 500$ of printing it up in brass.

    4.) Rules, rules, rules. Brass and Bronze appear fairly easy to design for, silver slightly less so, but stainless steel can be a nightmare because of all the rules, especially that pesky sandcastle rule. However, with electroplating for plastics, you wouldn't need to worry about that! The rules for plastics tend to be fairly forgiving.

    So to recap:

    -It CAN be done.
    -It would be more convenient.
    -It would be faster.
    -You know, trust, and have done business with Shapeways (or presumably you wouldn't be here :p).
    -It would be a great deal more cost effective than printing things up in real metal.
    -Designing for plastic can sometimes be far easier than designing for metals.

    And there you have it. That's my argument. I'd love to see a discussion on this topic. Would you want Shapeways to offer this service? Why or why not? Potential pitfalls? Anything I missed? GO! Discuss, my fellow Shapers and Makers.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2013
  2. barkingdigger
    barkingdigger Well-Known Member
    Assuming it can be done, how will it fare againt the inherent bendiness of thin parts in FD/FUD plastics?
     
  3. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    I would assume that if you were going to have something plated, you probably wouldn't want to bend it around or else the plating would crack. The plating would be entirely aesthetic. At least that's my guess. I don't know for certain.

    Right now, my biggest concern is just getting some momentum behind the idea. Ultimately it will be up to Shapeways to discern how feasible the idea is. But they won't even try unless enough people stand up and say "hey, we want this!" Maybe it won't be doable, maybe it will. But right now, we just need to ask them if they can try.

     
  4. AmLachDesigns
    AmLachDesigns Well-Known Member
    Unless I missed something, the rules for silver are the same as for Bronze and Brass. Yes, SS is a pain.
     
  5. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2013
  6. mkroeker
    mkroeker Well-Known Member
    I recall seeing some pretty convincing images of models that were post-processed with metal effect paints, did you explore that option ? (Think I dug up some of the old threads in your cutlery bowl thread, but I am in a hurry to leave right now)
     
  7. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    I have tried metallic paints (acrylic and gold fleck) and I was unimpressed with the results. The model ended up looking very matte. I want a nice shiny and reflective look without having to break my bank open. The only way I can imagine that happening is through electroplating.
     
  8. AmLachDesigns
    AmLachDesigns Well-Known Member
    No, not really. If I want plastic I'll go for plastic, and likewise for metal. Personally I always find plated plastic a little disappointing - it's fine to look at but when you handle it, the weight is missing.

     
  9. FreeRangeBrain
    FreeRangeBrain Active Member
    I would most DEFINITELY order plated plastics, high detail or not.
     
  10. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    Excellent! I'm glad to hear it. :D My hope is that you'd get the look of real metal without the (sometimes) insane expense. Maybe someday the cost of metal 3D printing will drop precipitously but (if even) until then, electroplating seems like it might be a decent, affordable alternative for a nice metallic look.
     
  11. stannum
    stannum Well-Known Member
    Have you tried Alclad2 paints? They are lacquers for airbrushing.

    Have you looked at the Lego compatible hat posted days ago? It was plated and it showed all the plastic grain.
     
  12. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    Can you link me? Also presumably it was printed in unpolished SWF because polished, FDP, and FUD don't really have much in the way of grain.
     
  13. stannum
    stannum Well-Known Member
    It was polished then chrome plated. It shines but looks like as attacked by micro shotgun fire.
     
  14. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    Oooh, yeah, I see that. I kuh.......inda like it but at the same time, I wonder what effect that substance would have on polished SWF, FDP, and FUD. Would it still look like salt and pepper? In any case, I think it would be nice just to see if Shapewyas would consider the idea. If they couldn't get any aesthetically pleasing results or they couldn't get it to work, then I'm sure thy would just not add it to the material portfolio but at least we could say "hey, we tried, sorry." But if it does work and people like it, then hey, we get a new material/finish to work with and I always say more options is better than less......... well, to a point. XD But you know what I mean.
     
  15. stannum
    stannum Well-Known Member
    The effect you see is over pWSF.

    What do you mean with polished SWF? And FDP?
     
  16. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    Ooooh. I see. I guess the p stands for polished? I meant that I wonder if you would see that grainy quality with electroplating done on a model made in frosted detail plastic or frosted ultra detail. Hm........ I looked at Krylon mirror finish paint but that seems kinda iffy. Everything I've read seems to indicate that it is meant for glass..... I think. I haven't looked into Alclad yet.
     
  17. woody64
    woody64 Well-Known Member
    It was polished WSF. I would have expected a more shiny and smooth surface ...

    The next test will be run with white detailed.

    Would be a very cool option if a shiny look will b possible. Moreover I'm searching for a smooth colored 3d printed plastic. and that would be an option ,,,
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2013
  18. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    I hope I'm not being a bother but could you perhaps apprise me further on the details of your endeavor? Personally, I am looking for a less expensive alternative to the metals. Right now, a lot of my designs would be prohibitively expensive to print in any of the metals. Printing something up in plastic then having it plated would give me the look I want while keeping the cost down.
     
  19. Bobbiethejean
    Bobbiethejean Well-Known Member
    Well, after some research, it appears this wouldn't necessarily get the effect I was hoping for. I was really hoping for a cheaper alternative to the metals while still being able to enjoy that nice sheeny look.

    It still might be worth it for SW to try it out and see what happens but I don't expect we'll be seeing electroplated plastics as an option anytime soon, if ever.
     
  20. bartv
    bartv Member
    Hey Bobbiethejean,

    thanks for keeping us on our toes! This is a great discussion and I'll pass it along to our materials team.

    One of the issues I can see with plating has been mentioned before - flexible models may cause the plating to crack. Now if you print products for yourself this is not a big issue, but imagine selling something to an unsuspecting customer through your shop? They would certainly be disappointed if the plating dropped off.

    I'm not familiar enough with the technology, but I think you should expect special design guidelines for plated *SF materials. We've done this before: polished SF has slightly different requirements than 'vanilla' SF.

    Cheers!

    Bart